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maytrix
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Joined: 09/18/10
Posts: 5394
Loc: Massachusetts
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: Will_L]
      #1745636 - 09/13/17 10:11 AM (38.98.111.83)

In the case of moorings and the fixed income, I doubt they aren't going to take a hit on that. The contract clearly states (unless it has been changed) that on a total loss of the yacht, the contract can be terminated by either party. What seems to be a grey area is when will they be able to confirm the yachts are a total loss or not? I would think until they do that, they are on the hook for the fixed payments, but that might just be 1 month and this is the slow season anyway so it isn't as if every boat was earning revenue. I imagine once confirmed as a loss, the guaranteed payments will end?

I think owners for the most part should come out in an ok position since the boat in the first year or two is covered for its full value. It then gets lowered after that. How many will want to start over and how long will it take to get new boats to start over is a whole different question. I would think it might be more difficult for the custom charter companies since they don't have a bunch of boats already being built and on order like Moorings does. Many companies don't get the boat and then find an owner, they find an owner who wants to purchase a boat..etc.

So for sure, once things are running again, it will be a much smaller fleet. It will take years before things are back to where they were.

--------------------
Matt


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Michel_Benarrosh
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Joined: 12/22/00
Posts: 248
Loc: NY
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: zhawk]
      #1745678 - 09/13/17 11:20 AM (67.205.202.28)

Hello all.

I have been going to the BVI for 30 years. I cannot begin to describe how sad I am... Some French media, talking about St Martin, use the words: Biblical proportions. They also mention the fact that many St Martin residents are leaving, saying they will never return. Consequently, the French media now question if it is simply viable to live in the Caribbean any more...! I cannot find words...

Now, as being somewhat an industry insider, I have information saying that ALL OPERATORS pretty much lost ALL of their boats or 99% of them.
An operator like BVI YC losing all its boats is, I am afraid, a death sentence. It is heartbreaking. There is no way companies like this, or TMM, etc... will be able to replace their fleet for at least 1 year - IF they have buyers/owners willing to take on that experience again. Additionally, the boat builders were already sold out for 10 to 12 months BEFORE Irma - except perhaps for monohulls which are not the bulk of the industry.
Only large operators, assuming they can bring boats from other bases without disrupting the charter bookings at those bases, will be able to cover SOME of the BVI bookings this season, and certainly not all of them. Way too early to tell.

A last thought: if that massive boat destruction is confirmed, this is an event that will alter the face of the used boat industry for probably 2 years, since many charter boats are providing for the second hand market on a large scale.

What a sadness....

--------------------
Michel Benarrosh
Meb@sailonline.com


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StormJib
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Joined: 11/30/14
Posts: 1033
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: Michel_Benarrosh]
      #1745682 - 09/13/17 11:38 AM (199.168.151.165)

Look for the smaller players and opportunist to gather some of the boats declared a Constructive Total Loss to create a fleet of value boats. One example could be three 4800 hundreds one that sunk and survived with a good rig, one that flipped on the hard without a rig, one that was near rubbed to death on one side. Three hulls or even ten combined to make boats ready to sail and charter. The insurance underwriters will pay off single near new boats that are too risky to return to near new condition locally in a timely manner. Hulls with many critical parts that are near new and undamaged. The practice is to pay the policy limit and auction or otherwise liquidate with a new title the hull they just paid off. In the marine underwriting trade "totaled" or "Constructive Total Loss" does not mean worthless or impossible to ever float again. Buy ten hulls, put them on a barge to Trinidad, and sail back five or more.

The first step is a dock, brand(s), and cash. With a book of business there will be buyers for those boats once they are in charter somewhere. The Moorings started with ten boats that sailed from the yacht club dock in New Orleans. I was there. A least one of the old or the next new brands will rise from one or more of those boat piles.


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CGB
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Joined: 03/22/13
Posts: 316
Loc: now - or when ?
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: StormJib]
      #1745689 - 09/13/17 11:58 AM (70.49.187.173)

Well - looking for "any" silver lining in this...

Those upright hulls - could be used as temporary shelter for homeless
At least for the short-term

Not exactly what the owners would want to be happening - but....


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maytrix
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Joined: 09/18/10
Posts: 5394
Loc: Massachusetts
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: CGB]
      #1745691 - 09/13/17 12:07 PM (38.98.111.83)

I think they have already started doing that at Nanny Cay (with owners permission).

--------------------
Matt


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Laserking
Traveler


Joined: 09/21/04
Posts: 38
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: maytrix]
      #1745763 - 09/13/17 03:19 PM (66.83.92.194)

I appreciate the optimism of some of the posts. I unfortunately see it a bit differently. I have been going to the Virgin Islands since 1980. My first BVI charter was 1982. Irma was a once in a century event. The U.K. is an ocean away, unlike the USVI and the USA. The major problem with the BVI recovery is the scale of the damage and destruction. The boats have to be separated, identified, the damage assessed, insurance issues addressed and eventually resolved. This will take many months if not longer. The boats that are reparable will need to be fixed, but where is the space and labor and materials in the boatyards and marinas? The ones that are not will have to be moved somewhere. The charter bases are all heavily damaged. Some of the smaller companies do not have deep reserves. There is no functioning infrastructure, and this will take months to get back together on even a rudimentary level (i.e., roads, electrical, water treatment, etc). There are no functioning grocery stores. Most supplies and material will have to come by water. There is limited skilled labor, and the need will be greatest to get the buildings and homes put back together. People are homeless and jobless on all of the islands and most lived week to week even before this storm. It's just a tremendous tragedy all the way around. I do believe that the BVI will eventually recover, but the fact that they depend on yachting tourism almost exclusively makes it a more difficult and much more lengthy process. I am still planning on going in February, but to volunteer, not sail. I respect everyone who wants to still go and charter. I hope that things will recover more quickly than I imagine, but it's hard for me to be optimistic. God bless the wonderful people of those magnificent islands and all of those trying so hard to help.

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hikernut
Traveler


Joined: 06/22/05
Posts: 12
Loc: AZ
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: Laserking]
      #1745775 - 09/13/17 04:12 PM (198.175.253.81)

Quote:

Laserking said:
I am still planning on going in February, but to volunteer, not sail.




My wife and I discussed volunteering, if and when it makes sense. We don't have any direct contacts on any of the islands, though, so I wouldn't even know where to start. For now we send money to help the established entities with emergency response.


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GlennAModerator
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Joined: 04/06/04
Posts: 10830
Loc: Macon, Georgia
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: Laserking]
      #1745778 - 09/13/17 04:18 PM (70.177.24.194)

I don't believe food is going to be a problem. Both RTW/Riteway and One Mart are open and have shipments arriving. Fuel also is not in poor supply though distribution is a problem. Electricity is the big one.

If you closely examine the wreckage in Paraquita Bay it looks like more than half of the boats are locally salvagable and while maybe not up to Moorings standards can economicaly be brought back to serve the second market. However, there is not enough labor in the islands to rebuild the housing and restore the charter fleet.

It all depends on how the BVI government acts from this point forward and judging by their actions over the last 6 days the outlook is not good. The draconian work permit rules and processing and a short sighted attitude import duties will be a windfall profit for the government. If they continue to restrict labor and try to profit from material imports making it harder and more expensive to restore their boats the boat owners are going to take their insurance money and go elsewhere.

--------------------
Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. - Mark Twain


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Laserking
Traveler


Joined: 09/21/04
Posts: 38
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: hikernut]
      #1745786 - 09/13/17 04:40 PM (66.83.92.194)

There is a thread on this forum regarding volunteering. Here is the link to the website. https://www.bvivolunteers.com

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kunphuzn
Traveler


Joined: 04/26/10
Posts: 39
Re: Upcoming Charters [Re: GlennA]
      #1745797 - 09/13/17 05:09 PM (204.153.60.10)

I have been staying out of this because I felt that it was not my place to opine when I have such great sadness and sympathy but really no clue what these ppl in a place that I love are going through. My heart breaks for them and I am actually more concerned for the folks in the Caribbean than I am for my home state and Florida. However, I agree with Glenn. The BVI gov't would be smart to open up their work permit regulations and let the islands become the construction boom of the century.

Investors will come, but money without labor is pointless. Plus rebuild cannot be done on "island time". I know there is no comparison, but in Texas after spring storms with damage, roofers are beating down your door to get your roof replacement and they come from all over the country. Construction companies and workers go where the work is. If the islands open up their doors to workers, looking for gainful employment at a decent wage, things can turn around exponentially more quickly than if they just let BVI workers work construction projects, etc.

The wheels wont start turning until basic infrastructure is in place and that is on the gov't, but after electricity and communications are back up, bring on the US and British construction companies to get in there and rock this thing out. That includes rebuilding roads (contract that s&$% out) and homes and businesses.

I am hoping once the shock and awe has passed that the gov't will realize that they cannot do this on their own and they need to outsource the rebuilding of their beautiful home. If they follow that path, give it a year and by time construction is wrapping up the flora and fauna will be coming back and with that, so will the tourist $$$'s.


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