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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Dutch government firm on conditions
      #1750037 - 10/23/17 06:42 PM (107.77.253.4)

Daily Herald story Marlin and the SXM government need to agree to their conditions. Period.

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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750043 - 10/23/17 08:16 PM (67.70.127.140)

This is byond incredible!

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WWII
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: moxie]
      #1750046 - 10/23/17 08:50 PM (72.224.104.94)

How so?

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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: WWII]
      #1750047 - 10/23/17 08:57 PM (67.70.127.140)

Marlin will not agree to their terms which seem to me to be reasonable so the island will not receive the much needed money to recover.

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sunseeker
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750048 - 10/23/17 08:58 PM (142.167.1.114)

Due diligence is a must when in the situation now facing SXM.
We have all seen the stories of the construction vultures arriving in numerous locations in the world following disasters. With the resulting millions wasted together with inferior reconstruction.


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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: moxie]
      #1750050 - 10/23/17 09:00 PM (107.77.253.4)

Agreed. St. Maarten needs to agree to the Dutch conditions. Period.

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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750052 - 10/23/17 09:10 PM (67.70.127.140)

Thank-you Carol. I was starting to think rhat I had missed something here.

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pat
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750059 - 10/23/17 11:03 PM (75.133.113.202)

Having learned too many times over too many years how things often seem to happen on Sint Maarten, I don’t blame them for insisting on these things. There has to be some integrity and accountability, both of which have often been missing in the Island government’s dealings. Don’t know how the border thing would work out but for sure, there has to be accountability over that kind of money, and the people who so desperately need it shouldn’t be held hostage in this mess.

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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: pat]
      #1750065 - 10/24/17 07:11 AM (131.161.86.149)

The Prime Minister sucks.

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deputydog1157
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750070 - 10/24/17 08:13 AM (199.47.254.33)

Don't sugar coat it, tell us how you really feel. LOL

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The_Lurker
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750071 - 10/24/17 08:23 AM (24.44.41.166)

I can't get the article.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: The_Lurker]
      #1750076 - 10/24/17 09:06 AM (73.255.141.246)

The Daily Herald has been having a lot of problems recently. Try back later.

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deputydog1157
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: The_Lurker]
      #1750078 - 10/24/17 09:21 AM (199.47.254.33)

I was able to get the article after a few attempts. Like Carol said the DH servers have been acting up. Having said that I re-read the article and it seems to me, reading in between the lines, that the Dutch government doesn't have much faith in the St. Maarten government to be good stewards of the funding. I can understand their stand because of what I've read of the current PM.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: deputydog1157]
      #1750082 - 10/24/17 09:46 AM (73.255.141.246)

Doesn't matter which recent PM you are talking about, the SXM government in general has not been good stewards of the people's money.

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irina
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750086 - 10/24/17 10:06 AM (136.28.35.128)

Ha! Everyone knows about those "wrong" pockets!

Hello GeBe!?!


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deputydog1157
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750087 - 10/24/17 10:13 AM (199.47.254.33)

Zackly, hence the preconditions, which IMO are necessary. I believe it is very foolish position for the PM to take when the people of St. Maarten NEED the assistance and rebuilding the economy through reconstructione is the only way to do it. Again, I think that if one has nothing to hide then one would embrace an oversight committee to be a system of checks and balances. As for the border situation, I can only imagine that it wouldn't really be to hurt the residents and/or tourists but rather to make sure that those coming in to help the rebuilding are there legally. Unfortunately there are some that will dwell upon those in need with criminal actions. Definitely think the SXM gov't is hiding something. As the old saying goes, "He doth protest too much."

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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: deputydog1157]
      #1750094 - 10/24/17 10:37 AM (131.161.86.149)

Well said , thanks.

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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: deputydog1157]
      #1750100 - 10/24/17 11:23 AM (96.231.206.165)

I completely agree. We were talking about this last night. There is no reason not to have oversight. You are the ones asking for something (money) so you should be willing to do WHATEVER the person giving wants. Why can't it be transparent and have an integrity committee? That means you are hiding something.
Let the Sunshine In.

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"It is good to do nothing all day, and then to rest" ;)



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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750116 - 10/24/17 02:14 PM (208.87.107.66)

So I wonder - if the people who need this relief want it to come in WITH conditions, is there anyway for them to force Marlin's hands? It's unbelievable that at a time like this, he's playing politics with relief funds. ALL relief funds come with strings and conditions.

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thebowl
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Angelface]
      #1750119 - 10/24/17 03:26 PM (107.1.119.41)

Quote:

Angelface said:
So I wonder - if the people who need this relief want it to come in WITH conditions, is there anyway for them to force Marlin's hands? It's unbelievable that at a time like this, he's playing politics with relief funds. ALL relief funds come with strings and conditions.




He holds an elected office, so there's bound to be a way for the political process to run its course. How long can he continue to hold his ground in the face of his constituents, who are desperate for the aid? Who knows? Probably not very long would be my guess.

I am not at all surprised that he is making a lot of noise about this. As I mentioned, there is a democratic system of some sort, and the insistence on an "Accountability Commission" constitutes a vote of no confidence in him by the Netherlands. They are saying in a very direct way that they do not trust him to do what he has been elected to do. If he is as pure as the driven snow, this is patronizing and offensive. And if he isn't, he will lose the ability to deal the money out to his friends. For him, it's bad either way.

But the money talks, so there's no question how this ends. Just when.


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irina
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: thebowl]
      #1750120 - 10/24/17 03:50 PM (136.28.35.128)

Sint Maarteners need to organize and show up at Administration building and get TDH, everyone involved. Not the status quo. Enough already. This is what I told a friend to do when she got a $1000 usd Gebe bill for August and Sept. With no power or water since Sept 5th.
Wish I was down there organizing!


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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: thebowl]
      #1750126 - 10/24/17 04:44 PM (67.70.127.140)

The offer was only until Oct. 31st-haven’t heard of any extensions.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750167 - 10/25/17 08:15 AM (107.77.253.4)

Theo says to give the Dutch what they demand. Daily Herald story

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irina
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750200 - 10/25/17 10:59 AM (136.28.35.128)

Theo smart. Can't squeeze something that is dry. He's been around a long time now!
Grandpa would be proud! LOL


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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750237 - 10/25/17 02:40 PM (67.70.127.140)

According to a post on FB the government has now turned down the conditions set so no money from Holland will be coming. I just can’t believe this.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: moxie]
      #1750239 - 10/25/17 02:45 PM (73.255.141.246)

An OFFICIAL government post on Facebook?

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Snorkeller
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750248 - 10/25/17 03:28 PM (108.4.118.232)

http://www.sintmaartengov.org/PressRelea...-Servants-.aspx

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Snorkeller]
      #1750251 - 10/25/17 03:43 PM (73.255.141.246)

Sorry, which means what? Sounds like they are still negotiating?

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Snorkeller
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750256 - 10/25/17 04:04 PM (108.4.118.232)

It means Marlin is saying NO to the Dutch and he seems to believe that the Dutch have to give in to him. His offer to "negotiate" is simply a politician trying to sound at least marginally competent. The fact that Rutte has indefinitely postponed his visit to SXM suggests to me that the Dutch are going to let Marlin at least delay if not kill an aid package getting done. I hope Marlin is prepared for a serious riot if he actually angers the Dutch enough to stop the aid from happening.

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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750257 - 10/25/17 04:04 PM (67.70.127.140)

It sure looked official but now I can’t find it so maybe not-hope not.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Snorkeller]
      #1750258 - 10/25/17 04:13 PM (73.255.141.246)

OK. Riot is correct. God help Sint Maarten.

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thebowl
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: moxie]
      #1750259 - 10/25/17 04:17 PM (107.1.119.41)

This is not "negotiating". He is sitting at a table by himself. This is called "posturing". The Netherlands holds all of the cards, every single one. Again, the PM can express real or feigned outrage, but at the end of the day, he will do what the Netherlands requires, or there will be no money.

Autonomy and independence are two way streets. Without getting too political, a number of the affected islands have the same issue, including Anguilla. You want to be "independent"? No problem. That means you are on your own, with aid a purely private matter. If I exercise no control over you, then I owe you nothing.


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PrairieGirl
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: thebowl]
      #1750265 - 10/25/17 04:55 PM (142.165.85.188)

Correct on all counts.

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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: thebowl]
      #1750267 - 10/25/17 05:02 PM (97.96.31.128)

Couldn't have said it any better myself. Most of the St. Maarten politicians are in it only for themselves. Not all of them, but for sure most of them. It is about time for their constituents to demand they do what they were elected to do--and that is take care of St. Maarten residents. I can't for the life of me imagine why the same bunch of thieves who have lied to them in the past over and over keep being elected.

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irina
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: PrairieGirl]
      #1750268 - 10/25/17 05:02 PM (136.28.35.128)

But Theo is already riling up the people now.
Marlin needs to get over himself.


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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750315 - 10/26/17 09:53 AM (73.255.141.246)

Not that anything will change in Marlin's position, but there is supposed to be a meeting of Parliament at 4 PM today to discuss this matter.

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thebowl
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750319 - 10/26/17 10:07 AM (107.1.119.41)

I will not pretend to be at all familiar with the form of government in Sint Maarten. That said, if there is a Parliament, and if he is a Prime Minister, it sure sounds like some form of Parliamentary government. If that is the case, the Parliament usually has the power to remove a Prime Minister by a vote of "no confidence". Does anyone here know if that is actually the case?

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Snorkeller
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: thebowl]
      #1750321 - 10/26/17 10:20 AM (108.4.118.232)

Yes - a basic parliamentary system.

On a vote of no confidence the Prime Minister "shall resign."

Or, if you could put together enough votes - probably require a supermajority - the Prime Minister probably could be dismissed.

I suppose it possible that this is a big enough deal that Marlin's government could fall - I will believe it when I see it.


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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Snorkeller]
      #1750322 - 10/26/17 10:27 AM (174.193.129.81)

Doesn't the government there fall fairly frequently? I seem to recall reading about that on multiple occasions.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750323 - 10/26/17 11:22 AM (73.255.141.246)

For those interested, the parliament meeting is supposed to be carried live on www.pearlfmradio.sx and www.sxmparliament.org There is some kind of a session going on now, but the session about the Dutch aid is supposed to be 4 PM today.

And yes, the SXM government has fallen many times, but I would doubt it in this situation.


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thebowl
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750336 - 10/26/17 12:50 PM (108.24.77.161)

If thumbing your nose at the only conceivable source of significant funding desperately needed to restore the island (half) to any semblance of normality won't cause the government to fall, what would? Particularly if it happens often, over other (less important) stuff.

It is one thing for one person to ignore the plight of the citizens. For him to remain in office will require a majority of the members of Parliament to do so. Could become a very different dynamic.


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SXMBND
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: MrWhiskerssammy]
      #1750368 - 10/26/17 06:02 PM (65.96.96.4)

Quote:

MrWhiskerssammy said:
Couldn't have said it any better myself. Most of the St. Maarten politicians are in it only for themselves. Not all of them, but for sure most of them. It is about time for their constituents to demand they do what they were elected to do--and that is take care of St. Maarten residents. I can't for the life of me imagine why the same bunch of thieves who have lied to them in the past over and over keep being elected.




Sounds like Congress.


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BeachKitten
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750369 - 10/26/17 06:54 PM (96.231.206.165)

Has there been any news from the 4:00 meeting?

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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: BeachKitten]
      #1750373 - 10/26/17 07:39 PM (131.161.86.143)

It was stopped with walk outs .

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750374 - 10/26/17 07:39 PM (107.77.253.11)

Sorry, what does that mean?

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pat
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750375 - 10/26/17 07:41 PM (75.133.113.202)

Quote:

Kennys said:
It was stopped with walk outs .




Are you saying the SXM government officials walked out?! OMG! Is it time to recall them all?

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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: pat]
      #1750378 - 10/26/17 07:59 PM (131.161.86.143)

The only way the Government can fall is if the partners in Government quit.

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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750379 - 10/26/17 08:08 PM (184.151.37.42)

Who are the partners? Is it a coalition?

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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: moxie]
      #1750381 - 10/26/17 08:12 PM (131.161.86.143)

The coalition partners have to quit.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750386 - 10/26/17 08:40 PM (107.77.253.11)

Lesley--again, what did your statement about people walking out, what does that mean??

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BeachKitten
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750391 - 10/26/17 09:16 PM (96.231.206.165)

Are they all behind Marlin, and they think they should not agree to the Integrity Chamber?

Or can they get rid of him?

I'm so confused.

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BGH
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: BeachKitten]
      #1750397 - 10/26/17 09:36 PM (99.231.122.10)

Do you suppose Marlin and his followers have a back up plan ? Or r they willing to crash ?

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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750400 - 10/26/17 10:09 PM (131.161.86.143)

Carol,I didn't follow the details simply because they are playing games, which we all hate period.

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wilsonck
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: BeachKitten]
      #1750403 - 10/26/17 11:37 PM (73.148.207.131)

Both Theodore Heyliger, leader of United Peoples party, and Sarah Wescot-Williams, leader of Democratic Party, both support accepting the conditions set forth by the Netherlands. Not sure about the others.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750405 - 10/27/17 08:08 AM (107.77.253.11)

Daily Herald story Looks like Parliament is fiddling while Rome burns..

Edited by Carol_Hill (10/27/17 08:16 AM)


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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750411 - 10/27/17 08:43 AM (131.161.86.143)

Yes and you are correct on this , hence the reason not to literally follow their details. Me ,Wife , Daughter and Son have our work to do and handle. We never voted for the current PM but the tough part is that if he survives it will be for four more years in power . Really hope that this does not happen.

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BGH
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750413 - 10/27/17 08:46 AM (99.231.122.10)

Must be something they are drinking . This group of elected officials can’t even organize a meeting !

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: BGH]
      #1750417 - 10/27/17 09:22 AM (73.255.141.246)

You are assuming that they WANT to hold a meeting. They have been doing this stuff for years. Someone doesn't show up so they don't have a quorum, so they can have an excuse not to do anything. As I said, 'fiddling while Rome burns'..

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BGH
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750420 - 10/27/17 09:35 AM (99.231.122.10)

“They” could mean “One” wanted to hold a meeting . Where we live that is normal but as we all know , Sxm operates beyond the norm.

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pat
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: BGH]
      #1750431 - 10/27/17 10:35 AM (75.133.113.202)

For well over thirty years I’ve been trying to understand how the government operates here, and why the people keep electing the same ilk of officials election after election. To this day I still don’t get it.

But I do get ‘the people’ are currently getting screwed. They need help and they need it now and the government seems to be going out of its way to see that help doesn’t come.

What a shame the higher powers in control of the purse strings should ask for transparency and accountability with regard to the millions of Euros involved here, (she says with tongue firmly planted in cheek!) .........

God help the people of SXM.

--------------------
Respectfully,

pat



"Always keep your words soft and sweet, just in case you have to eat
them."


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BGH
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: pat]
      #1750444 - 10/27/17 12:11 PM (99.231.122.10)

Those elected officals must live on a private island somewhere .

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islandgem
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750445 - 10/27/17 12:15 PM (99.240.194.39)

I am confused with all these political posts here. I thought politics was not tolerated on the forum.In the past, posts have been shut down because of this, but somehow SXM politics seems to be different.

--------------------


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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: islandgem]
      #1750452 - 10/27/17 02:07 PM (73.255.141.246)

Yes, SXM politics are different.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750479 - 10/27/17 08:02 PM (107.77.253.11)

Sarah says enough is enough. Daily Herald story

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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750480 - 10/27/17 08:07 PM (131.161.86.143)

My Wife just showed me the video and now I'm feeling much better. Please look at how the MPS are nervous and shaking. Harsh reality has finally kicked in.

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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750485 - 10/27/17 09:35 PM (184.151.37.46)

It’s high time.

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weluvbeachncuzzi
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: moxie]
      #1750489 - 10/27/17 11:24 PM (174.217.9.130)

Being uneducated on St. Maarten/St. Martin's governmental structure (even though having been there 6 times) this is actually interesting. Could someone explain who all these names, groups, etc. are?

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PelicanPirate
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Snorkeller]
      #1750492 - 10/28/17 07:45 AM (98.29.235.208)

I dont know sxm government structure at all. But I did here Marlin speak manyntimes on the radio after the storm. Seems very bright. It cant be easy governing any Caribbean island. Look at PR if you dont like GEBE.

As for the oversight, there has to be some, the question is how much.

I do know many countries of the world get handcuffed when the IMF comes in to “help” with loans and all during financial crises.

That may not apply here as might just be aid coming that does not require strings or repayment and dutch just want to make sure not squandered orr corrupted, how will the dutch hand out the cash? Is it aid or a loan? Who decides amounts?

Anyway, like i said, dont understand govt structure or what the dutch are giving and demanding exactly.

--------------------
Just the other night I was sleeping under a bridge and now here I am on the grandest ship in the world having champagne with you fine people.
Jack Dawson - Movie Titanic

Edited by PelicanPirate (10/28/17 07:48 AM)


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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750496 - 10/28/17 09:10 AM (107.77.253.5)

New Dutch official still wants to help SXM and work it out. Daily Herald story Come on eggheads, get this done, for the good of the people!!

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BGH
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750500 - 10/28/17 10:20 AM (99.231.122.10)

Marlin is playing a very dangerous poker game and the odds are not good .

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SXMBND
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: BGH]
      #1750502 - 10/28/17 11:00 AM (65.96.96.4)

The Islands Govt. corruption has been well documented...... they don't sign the deal as is......no $$$$. Where is the SXM $$$ for the rebuild???

Edited by SXMBND (10/28/17 11:02 AM)


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bksm
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: BGH]
      #1750512 - 10/28/17 12:51 PM (47.197.21.5)

Does anyone know what Marlin's problem is with the Integrity Chamber and/or the better border control?

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: bksm]
      #1750516 - 10/28/17 02:13 PM (107.77.253.5)

My understanding is that he feels it is a violation of SXM's independent status as a country. .....meanwhile, there will be no country left, as a result of his hubris..

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sasasal
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750517 - 10/28/17 02:25 PM (24.102.161.71)

this government is very corrupt... Many residents are aware of this. Marlin has taken money from investers, and put it in his pocket...this is what I have been told. Why this continues??? Not sure... It kind of reminds me of Puerto rico, they want to be independent, but want the U.S. to pour money in... Hope this does not offend anyone, but this is a reality... Your either independent or not... St.M. with this government can not survive... Marlin should give up all the money he received from Chinese investers to rebuild the Island My opinion, and that of many that live on Island

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BGH
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: sasasal]
      #1750522 - 10/28/17 04:35 PM (99.231.122.10)

Strong statements and a common thread on this site . Where is the money trail ?

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SXMScubaman
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: sasasal]
      #1750538 - 10/29/17 10:26 AM (174.216.18.0)

Quote:

sasasal said:
this government is very corrupt... Many residents are aware of this. Marlin has taken money from investers, and put it in his pocket...this is what I have been told. Why this continues??? Not sure... It kind of reminds me of Puerto rico, they want to be independent, but want the U.S. to pour money in... Hope this does not offend anyone, but this is a reality... Your either independent or not... St.M. with this government can not survive... Marlin should give up all the money he received from Chinese investers to rebuild the Island My opinion, and that of many that live on Island



Lots of allegations. Where is the documented proof?


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SXMBND
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: SXMScubaman]
      #1750539 - 10/29/17 10:53 AM (65.96.96.4)

Interesting facts and probable motivation for the Dutch Govt. insistence to rules regarding the bailout $$$$

From Wikipedia:

"Debt

On November 2, 2006, the Dutch government set aside 65 million guilders (NAF) to pay off St. Maarten's debts. The Dutch portion of the island became a country within the Kingdom of the Netherlands in 2010. While this was beneficial in some ways, the decision has shifted more responsibilities over to the island and with those, more debt.[5] Since St. Maarten became an autonomous country in 2010, it has never had a balanced budget and it has accumulated a debt of 200 million guilders (NAF) according to a statement by the Minister of Finance in December 2015.[20][21]"

This is a country of less than 40,000 citizens........do the math folks.

Edited by SXMBND (10/29/17 10:55 AM)


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Todd
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: SXMBND]
      #1750544 - 10/29/17 12:13 PM (67.171.251.248)

Doing the math- updated with new starting numbers
200,000,000 NAF divided by 40,000 people = 5000 NAF per person.
5000 NAF per person equals about $2850 USD.

In the US our national debt is about $60,000 per person.
That equals about $106,0000 in NAF.

If the SXM debt was at the same rate as here in the US per person then they would be at $4,240,000,000 NAF or about $2,400,000,000 USD.

Spin this what ever way you want and have a great morning. Feel free to correct any math errors, still early here on the West Coast.
Cheers,
Todd

Edited by Todd (10/29/17 01:47 PM)


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SXMBND
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Todd]
      #1750549 - 10/29/17 02:37 PM (65.96.96.4)

Quote:

Todd said:
Doing the math- updated with new starting numbers
200,000,000 NAF divided by 40,000 people = 5000 NAF per person.
5000 NAF per person equals about $2850 USD.

In the US our national debt is about $60,000 per person.
That equals about $106,0000 in NAF.

If the SXM debt was at the same rate as here in the US per person then they would be at $4,240,000,000 NAF or about $2,400,000,000 USD.

Spin this what ever way you want and have a great morning. Feel free to correct any math errors, still early here on the West Coast.
Cheers,
Todd




There was no intent to make a comparison between a country of 250+ million people.....1/2 of which pay no taxes, and are taken care of cradle to grave by the government and a COUNTRYwith a population (~40K) that would be representative in size of a small U.S CITY. That comparison would be foolish.
A couple a hundred Million $$$$ are generated yearly as a direct result of tourism taxes alone, T/S.....airport, cruise ships. They obviously don't spend diddly on infrastructure,military or entitlements......so tell us where the money goes????

Edited by SXMBND (10/29/17 02:38 PM)


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sasasal
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: SXMBND]
      #1750551 - 10/29/17 03:16 PM (24.102.161.71)

Take a look at the roads!!!Nothing ever done to repair. Very dangerous . we have been going to sxm for many years, and have heard that anyone that want to start a business on Island, just has to shell our money to government officials. This is going on for years... Hand over the cash and things get done. Proof???? Everyone that lives on Island knows how crooked this government is... They put cash in there pocket, and the Island gets nothing done... marlin is a crooked . Period...

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sasasal
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: SXMScubaman]
      #1750552 - 10/29/17 03:19 PM (24.102.161.71)

Sometimes you do not need documented proof. Do you really think government can not hide things????? This is an Island, who has the power to get real proof... The proof is in the aligations from many people over the years... Ask the residents what they think!!! Not ttol people..

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jmbcomms
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: BGH]
      #1750555 - 10/29/17 05:09 PM (73.167.75.90)

Everyone except the Dutch Side government "gets" it.

--------------------
Jeff Berger
Visiting SXM Since 1978


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Todd
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: SXMBND]
      #1750556 - 10/29/17 05:09 PM (67.171.251.248)

I just did the math and added a comparison for reference, I could have used Canada or France which is about half of what the US is but easier to relate to where most of us live. I think Netherlands per person debt is about $38k in USD but a bit more difficult to be sure of. Not political, not saying anything is right, just did math as requested with the info given with a slightly researched reference point.
Cheers,
T


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ARC
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: SXMBND]
      #1750574 - 10/29/17 09:50 PM (99.59.208.130)

Quote:

SXMBND said:
Quote:

Todd said:
Doing the math- updated with new starting numbers
200,000,000 NAF divided by 40,000 people = 5000 NAF per person.
5000 NAF per person equals about $2850 USD.


In the US our national debt is about $60,000 per person.
That equals about $106,0000 in NAF.

If the SXM debt was at the same rate as here in the US per person then they would be at $4,240,000,000 NAF or about $2,400,000,000 USD.

Spin this what ever way you want and have a great morning. Feel free to correct any math errors, still early here on the West Coast.
Cheers,
Todd




There was no intent to make a comparison between a country of 250+ million people.....1/2 of which pay no taxes, and are taken care of cradle to grave by the government and a COUNTRYwith a population (~40K) that would be representative in size of a small U.S CITY. That comparison would be foolish.
A couple a hundred Million $$$$ are generated yearly as a direct result of tourism taxes alone, T/S.....airport, cruise ships. They obviously don't spend diddly on infrastructure,military or entitlements......so tell us where the money goes????




Sounds like a typical west coast train of thought! Nice comeback SXMBND, very true!


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AUCspouse
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: ARC]
      #1750590 - 10/30/17 06:52 AM (72.169.80.216)

Todd,
I, for one, appreciate your math. Thanks.


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thebowl
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: AUCspouse]
      #1750594 - 10/30/17 08:40 AM (107.1.119.41)

Me too. Facts can be your friend, if you let them.

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BlueGreenWater
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: sasasal]
      #1750625 - 10/30/17 01:29 PM (108.44.146.192)

Quote:

sasasal said:
Sometimes you do not need documented proof. Do you really think government can not hide things????? This is an Island, who has the power to get real proof... The proof is in the aligations from many people over the years... Ask the residents what they think!!! Not ttol people..




"Sometimes you do not need documented proof....The proof is in the aligations..."

Ummm, no.



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Snorkeller
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Snorkeller]
      #1750637 - 10/30/17 05:24 PM (108.4.118.232)

Looks like Sarah and Theo have pulled Chanel Brownbill away from USP/NA. So, DP, UPP, and Brownbill are 8 MPS - which is a majority of 15 MPS total. If Brownbill can withstand pressure and hold his ground, looks like Sarah may be PM again and aid with conditions will happen. No idea how fast they can get Marlin out and new government in place - if in fact they have at least the 8 MPs. Dutch certainly have no reason to do anything other than wait for new government and agreement to conditions.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Snorkeller]
      #1750642 - 10/30/17 06:38 PM (107.77.253.5)

I saw that in the DH today about Brownbill. Doing what needs to be done, hopefully.

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moxie
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750643 - 10/30/17 06:42 PM (67.70.127.140)

I was so hoping that this would happen-lets keep our fingers crossed.

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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: moxie]
      #1750683 - 10/31/17 07:44 AM (131.161.86.135)

We were waiting for this to happen. Honesty has to now prevail how the funds will be spent.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750686 - 10/31/17 08:09 AM (107.77.253.5)

I'm real confused. Marlin apparently agreed to the conditions on Monday

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Kennys
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Carol_Hill]
      #1750689 - 10/31/17 08:24 AM (131.161.86.135)

He tried a "late change " after he learnt about what was going to happen to him.

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Carol_HillAdministrator
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750697 - 10/31/17 09:16 AM (73.255.141.246)

OK

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SXMBND
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Re: Dutch government firm on conditions [Re: Kennys]
      #1750703 - 10/31/17 09:51 AM (65.96.96.4)

Quote:

Kennys said:
He tried a "late change " after he learnt about what was going to happen to him.




Typical politician.


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