If Club Orient was NOT there...

IF Club Orient was NOT there and it was a French Beach with Clothing Optional section but no resort... Would you go to SXM?

Heck yes. Clothing optional isn't my thing so it makes no difference to me.

Is this a trick question?

I’ll concede, there are people who go to SXM for the pleasure of the clothing optional experience only and many of those people enjoy Club Orient as their preferred place to stay, but there are thousands who really could care less about either one. St. Maarten/St. Martin is so much more than just a clothing optional experience and I know you know that, too.

The beaches are beautiful and incredible: the dining options range from burgers to French Bistros to Lolos to exclusive dining options to pizza places and so many other possibilities;the people are generally friendly and kind and until The b itch Irma raised her ugly head, the logistics of getting there along with affordability of doing so were both doable for huge numbers of Americans, this one included. The free port shopping used to be awesome even if not so much these days but bargains can still be found if you look hard. And then there are the other things such as activities and out-Island experiences that° can be enjoyed from SXM so easily.

I think you’re pulling our leg with this question?

Respectfully Pat this is not a trick question and I am not pulling your leg!

My husband honestly stated that if Club Orient were not there we would not go back!

That’s too bad because so many of us enjoy so much more about the island than just that feature and would go there in a heartbeat with or without clothing optional and/or Club Orient. But to each his own and if he really feels that way, at least now you know!

As an after thought, do you feel the same way?

I always knew! I saw Club Orient rebuild after Hurricane Luis in 1995 and I believe Club Orient will return to it's former self in the near future.
My question is to those who go to SXM only for the clothing optional beach and know they can go anywhere if a bathing suit is require!
Is the clothing optional, naturist thing the only draw?

There is always resorts in Jamaica and other islands that fill the co bill.

I thought you owned a house on the island, more specifically Guana Bay. This sounds foolish!

I thought so too. Confused.

What an interesting question. For me and my wife the answer is definitely yes, but it's important to remember that on SXM Club Orient really sets the tone for just not this island but all of the Caribbean. There is no other place quite like it, but if it didn't come back (rebuild) I would still visit St. Martin for the many reasons that 'Pat' and others listed above. The people, the dining, the shopping, the attractions, and so much more make SXM a very special place. Some people may not like what I am about to say, but in certain ways Club Orient has also hindered St. Martin. Before everyone gets their 'ire' up, please let me explain.

Many of the folks who visit and stay at Club Orient year-after-year have developed a type of 'right of ownership' here. Not everyone, but some people. Some are less than welcoming when people from cruise ships and other visitors in general walk down through the clothing optional section in front of Club 'O'. Warning signs about cameras, cell phone pictures, and the security personnel who watch over this area sometimes creates an atmosphere that is overly restrictive for those who are nothing more than curious. I have seen this first hand, and I often wish that those who choose to go without clothing would inter-mingle with those who keep their suits on. And, by all means stop treating the word 'textile' as some kind of negative thing.

Recently, my wife and I had the opportunity to visit the island of Mallorca in the Mediterranean Sea, and made it a point to spend a full day at Es Trenc beach near Campos on the island's south side. We had never been here before, but had heard about what a beautiful beach this was similar to those on Ibiza. After our driver dropped us off, we walked through different inter-connected beaches that lined this coast. First, there was a very calm beach that was occupied heavily by young families with small children. Then, a more standard beach similar to the primary section of Orient Beach. Next, was a gay section with primarily male couples, and then a large nude section which was comprised of people from all ages. There were single men, single women, families, couples, and so on. As we continued our walk, the nude section slowly faded and a more standard beach returned (although one in every four women went topless). There were no security guards watching everyone, nor warning signs regarding photography, or any type of rules that warned if you "crossed this line" the police will swoop in and fine you. It was refreshing watching the people who chose to wear swimsuits mix in comfortably with those who chose to go nude. Everyone was enjoying the day with or without apparel.

Here, my wife and I set up our beach umbrella and enjoyed a wonderful day under the sun. I couldn't help but compare this to Orient Beach and Club Orient. And, I must honestly say that as much as we have enjoyed all of Orient Beach in the past I wished at that moment it was more like this Spanish beach where everyone could do whatever best 'suited' them without all the rules and regulations. So, if Club Orient didn't return we would indeed return, but only if the new beach truly mirrored the clothing optional beaches of the French Riviera and the Balearic Islands. Either way, we will still be coming back to SXM for so may other reasons.

Good response and attitude. Total agreement on what you said about the attitudes of some co patrons.

One of the things we found interesting (and pleasant) during our visit last month was the mixture of clothed and nude people on the Club O section of Orient Beach, and their attitudes toward each other. Because it was really the only place one could rent good chairs and umbrellas, plus get a decent meal &/or drinks, the majority of visitors stayed on that end. Everyone mingled together and no one cared who wore what. Everyone was just happy to be there. It made any (real or imaginary) divide disappear. We were traveling with another couple who had been to the island several times before with us, but who had always been a bit reserved about beaching it down on the Club O section. (We usually prefer that end of the beach for various reasons), In any event, we all ended up down there together, more or less out of necessity. Our friends realized that sharing the beach with naturalists was no big deal, no one cared about those who wore suits, and we all had some wonderful days.

We will always return to SXM, even if there is no Club O. It’s wonderful, but so are many other things on the island. We do, however, hope they rebuild and come back strong.

Don't visit Club O so it is not why I continue to return to Sint Maarten (23 years now). Pat pretty much summed up our feelings toward the island. Not sure why Club O would be your only reason for going but to each his own.

I agree so much more !

If Club O is the only reason for you to go to St Martin, than you know absolutely nothing about the island.

The last few years I have been visiting SXM and Orient Beach in those months when Club Orient is closed. So, I would be more likely to go if Club O wasn't there. I just prefer the beach when there are fewer people there and I have more of the beach to myself.

1) It was a routine Eastern Caribbean cruise stop which first brought us to SXM and a routine island ship shore excursion that took us to Orient Beach. Before that day St Martin was just any other saint.
2) it was a yellow umbrella that caused us to buy our first plane tickets to St Martin
3) now we venture around and have stayed close off property but usually spend the day under yellow umbrella
4) this winter we’ll spend 10 days dutch side, will be interesting if distance weakens yellow umbrella magnetism

Before, St Maarten, our we’d love to live/die here place was St John, USVI. Weve only been back once since SXM became known to us. If they had yellow umbrellas, we would go there but I think SXM wins the entire Caribbean with or without Yellow Umbrellas although its much better with Club Orient.

Actually, Club Orient the resort is not there, but we are still going back.

Our procedure for years has been spending one week at Club Fantastico, one at Club O.

We will still spend our 1st week at CF, our 2nd in Oyster Pond (Naturist's Getaway). Now, the question has previously been asked "if you didn't have the c/o option, would you still return?". Of course we would, but not as often nor for as long.

Great response! Thanks!

I wanted to correct what I posted: If Club Orient closed and the property sold to developers that built villas and beach bars similar to the other end of the beach then we would not return. The way it stands now is Club Orient controls the beach in front of the resort even though the resort is closed so it is fine with me to go and carry in and carry out my beach chair, umbrella and cooler.

For us we discovered SXM and Orient Beach by way of a cruise, then we would stay a week every Feb/Mar for about 7 years at Alamanda Resort located along Orient Beach, so along with the great food and some of the wonderful sights coming up and down the beach during the day it was a great vacation every year, but with that said, we are getting older and have found Aruba much more safer, cleaner, just about guaranteed great hot weather, so easy to get around, food is for us more than adequate and quite good and gambling is within walking distance up and down Palm Beach.

Probably the next and only times we will ever see SXM again will be way of RCCL Cruise stops.

Interesting read.
https://www.nbcnews.com/better/amp/ncna893151?__twitter_impression=true

We have been going to sxm for many years. We went to orient once, felt totally not comfortable being clothed and being around nudes. No we do not undress, so for us???? never went back, and have no desire to go back. there are so many other beaches that lovely, Answer?? yup do not need club orient at all. but for sure, those that want to get nude will not live without it.

Orient was a CO beach before the wooden cottages were imported and became Club Orient. Pedros was a shack with a BBQ, most parked at La Galion and walked over. 20 people on the entire beach was a crowd. I haven't been on there for many years, still do CO on less crowded beaches both on SXM and other places, so, no I really don't care all that much.

We have been back since the Hurricane in an effort to support the island. Some of our dearest friends have been customers of Club Orient. We met these people at Club O. We have well over 30 trips to Club Orient. We have been to several c/o resorts but feel that the people who work at Club O are now not only friends but part of our family in the Caribbean. There really is nothing close to Club O in our minds. Everyone may decide where to spend their time on this beautiful island. We will not envision this island without Club O. We will however continue trips until the Club is rebuilt and open. Please support St. Martin and visit to help all rebuild. We always put the countdown clock on sitting in the departure area.

carib cheers all,

doctorj

Fact is, for a lot of people, it isn't "IF" Club O weren't there - it isn't! And that loyal following for Club O and for the clothing optional opportunities elsewhere on occasion - many have moved on. In our post-Irma travel, we've run across MANY SXM refugees in Maui, Caymans, Jamaica, and sailing in the VI's. For many, the clothing optional aspect was the driving decision to go to SXM in the first place, and then to return year after year. Among them, we've found two clear groups.

First are those that said they're not there this year just because of Irma issues - no place to stay, airfares, lousy connections, etc., but that they had planned to go back in 1-3 years and see how it has recovered. Usually following that was a statement that they've enjoyed traveling elsewhere and not sure about SXM anymore. Then after that, it was often "If we can't "enjoy Orient", then what's to differentiate it from other islands?"

The other group was more definite. A common theme - Club O is what attracted them to the island cause of the people they met there. No Club O = no reason to return. Several said the same words - it was a "chapter in our lives. It's over. Time for another chapter." Couples Sans Souci - full occupancy because of the nude beach, several others on Jamaica - same. At Maui - several people went out of their way to meet us and talk about SXM on our second day there when I wore an "SXM Strong" t-shirt. Lots more refugees - loving their new chapters.

We loved our times in SXM, and we'll be back another time and see "how it fits" then. Meanwhile, we're enjoying the heck out of visiting other places and wondering if we tied ourselves down too much to SXM. If we did, it was the clothing optional atmosphere and so-minded people that drew us there.

If you do the math "by beach", of course, >95% of SXM visitors have always gone to SXM for textile vacations. On the other hand, there are many who became enamored with the island after visiting Club O on a cruise and "gettin nekkid"! Those people are largely moving on.

To bad CO was the only reason to visit St Martin. What a loss on their part to not want to go back to a such diverse and multicultural island.

BTW, SXMMartini, great post! Interesting question!

Club O is not there at the moment, but we have still been back to the Island 3 times since Irma, still used the CO beach at Club O, but the island also has so much more to offer
as well.

No.

I just want to say, having been to Jamaica, you cannot compare the C/O resorts there to Orient Bay and the Club O stretch. They are very different.

We tried CO for the first time in OB in 2017, cancelled our return this May, will be back next May. But i the meantime, we discovered a CO beach 1/2 mile north of a condo we own on Hutchinson Island, FL. And we never ever knew about it for 12 years!!! No Pedro's, no bars, but lovely and peaceful.

Blind Creek Beach, nice place

In a word. Yes.

Absolutely. We haven't been to a clothing optional beach in at least five years. The island has so much more to offer!

I agree. We always visit Orient Beach,,,for the beach and variety of restaurants, etc. Clothing optional means nothing to us. I assume it will look much different when we visit next week, we fly out Saturday. But, having said that, I just cant imagine going to another island since discovering SXM in 2005. The cuisine, the beaches, all of it. And the friendly people we consistantlly run into. Cannot wait to return, this will be our first post Irma experience, and although things are slowly recovering, I am sure we will make the best of it. We always stay on the Dutch side. I still for whatever reason, do not feel 100 percent comfortable on the French Side,,,and I just can't tell you why. possibly because it isn't as familiar? Not sure, but we do travel over there a couple of times during our visit. I have yet to experience Harmony Nights,,I think because we usually travel earlier in January due to flights being cheaper out of Canada. This year we lucked out. 497.00 direct flight, later in the month, so getting my suitcase packed. Cannot wait.

This thread is 5 months old and although not outdated IMHO a new thread could have been started.Thanks for the BUMP!

Not all that familiar with message board jargon but your welcome, I think.
Cheers

Updated this thread from August 2018... I have recently visited Club Orient in January 2019 and I have to say it was very comfortable on the beach. Cedrick is doing an awesome job keeping the Club Orient guests happy. The perch lite is a great addition. We have never had a better server (Sha) and lunch was great! If you don't turn around honestly you would not realise the resort is closed!

The CO beach is more important than the/a CO resort. That said I would like to see the resort get there ducks lined up and rebuilt.

Certainly agree that it would be great if Club O returned. We loved the convenience of staying at the Club however it left much to be desired in terms of guest service and amenities. The beds were awful. There were bright spots as well, some great employees, but there was a lot of room for improvement.
Cheers.

Everything will be new and improved! New beds, new furniture etc. I am so looking forward to the new and improved CO.

Sorry this is so long.

Unfortunately we never stayed at Club O and it took us 15 years to actually stay on the island as a visitor to the island after numerous cruise visits. If Club O rebuilds before we are too old or dead we will stay there.

We had planned to go September 9th through the 16th 2017 for our 39th anniversary but a beeotch named Irma changed our plans. We decided to tempt fate again this past September for our 40th anniversary and it worked out great. We stayed in a VRBO condo on Billy Folly Road right on the water (villa Carisma). We were a little tentative about exploring too much because we were unfamiliar with the roads so we stayed mainly around the immediate area of Pelican.

We did make a trip to Philipsburg one day but didn't stay too long. We went to Back Street to try to find some local things rather than the typical tourist stuff that is all from China etc. It was very hot and Barbara was getting disgusted that all of the shops seemed to have the same things so we cut it short.

Another trip we made was to Orient Beach. Not knowing the roads I reached out to Elaine (BillandElaine) for directions and she gave me perfect guidance. We had been to the non-Club O section on our previous cruise visits but never the "Nekkid Beach" before. This trip was to get out of our comfort zone, more so for my wife than I. Well suffice it to say it was a no ships-in-port day on Monday, September 10th. We arrived so early the chain across the lot was still up so we parked in the taxi area behind what used to be Pedro's and walked to the Club O section as the guys were just starting to set up a few chairs. About 5 minutes later 2 other couples showed up (one couple was DonnDe from this forum and his wife).

It took us a minute to set up the chairs and put our towels and bags down. Not wanting to belabor the ultimate fear/anxiety of being nude outside in a public setting for the first time in my 61 years I just stripped down and walked into the water. I looked back and saw the love of my life, who had never been topless much less naked in her 65 years in public, suddenly take her top off and walk into the water. The other couples had already removed their clothes and we sitting on their chairs by this point. We stayed in the water a few minutes and then Barb walked back to her chair and to my surprise she removed her bottoms before lying on her chair. That was the beginning of our newfound freedom and neither of us felt awkward. A huge part of the reason was that the other 2 couples we met that day made us feel so welcome that we didn't even care that we were naked. DonnDe and his wife along with the other couple (real names not mentioned as I don't have their permission) were the epitome of the acceptance that we had read about on numerous blogs/articles about the non-judgmentalness of naturists. We stayed there a few hours until my fair Irish-heritage skin was getting more sun than I needed. As we were leaving and headed back to our condo Barb turned to me and said she had a great time and was shocked that after a few minutes she didn't care about being nude and actually forgot that she was. She said she wanted to make a return trip on Wednesday.

Wednesday came but the weather was rainy so we decided against going. Thursday came and the weather was better but not perfect. Thinking we'd have to cancel again I was afraid we wouldn't be able to have a return visit. Barbara looked at me and said "Let's have some breakfast and head out to Orient Beach." We ate something at the condo and we got ready to go to OB. I knew Barbara was OK with the idea of being naked on the beach because as she was getting dressed she put on just a t-shirt and gym shorts. I asked her if she was going to put her bathing suit on to which she replied. "Nope, not needed."

Enroute to the beach the skies were overcast but we saw spots of blue here and there. We arrived at the beach and parked behind the Perch Lite. When we arrived DonnDe, his wife, the other couple and few others had gathered under the covering because it had rained a few minutes earlier. DonnDe's wife had made some guacamole dip, which by the was fantastic, and offered some to all as we killed a few minutes waiting for the weather to cooperate. Ten minutes and a Presidente later, the ski was blue and chairs were being set up. Once we got settled in our chairs it was as if these folks were lifelong friends. We had numerous conversations and then others joined in. We had another couple from Florida take chairs next to us and there was a gentleman that was there also. Most of the folks had been at Club O and even though the description was that the resort was "rustic" there was nothing but positive reviews. We hated to leave but had made late lunch plans at the Buccaneer Beach Bar.

Barbara said she now sees that the convenience of the Club O resort could make for a great vacation because you could spend a week on vacation and only have to pack a carry on bag! The same outfit worn from home to the resort would be the same outfit worn home. No other clothing needed unless going off property. I hope they rebuild soon, we'd like to check a week at Club O off our bucket list.

Great story. I hope you get to enjoy the experience and convenience of staying at Club Orient. It truly was a special place to us. Thanks.

Welcome to the "club!"

Yes for Sure

YES, I have been visiting the island for about 12 years but never stayed at the club, but I did eat there and had drinks at the bar. I used to stay at the nudist resorts in Lutz Fl. and got burnt out on going, maybe that is why it did not interest me. I do like the nude beach, but the French food is amazing as are the people. I have made many friends on the beach, chatting and playing volleyball. I would like to see Club O rebuilt. I actually have a nude beach practically in my back yard, which is Apollo (Canaveral National Seashore) and go there about 4-5 days per week and walk. I have never found an Island like St. Maarten in my travels.

While we have not been back, it sounds like Club O is there. The buildings are not in working order but some of the clientele seems to have made it back and are enjoying what is there along with each other (Cedric, the Perch and the chairs. What won us over when we first got there was the people and the beach which are still there. We hope to make it if things work out. We appreciate the reports from people that have gone back anywhere on the island.

Club O was always more than just the buildings. It was always about the people and the beach. I do hope they are able to rebuild...

Ther are many places on the Earth, and some are very good, but no place, thus far, matches the south end of Orient Beach

I think we're all in agreement regarding the importance of rebuilding Club O. But, in reality it sounds like it's going to take a while. After Irma I know there were folks who figured they'd return in the spring of 2019 after everything was wiped out on that fateful September day. I wasn't so sure based on how things work on the French side of SXM. But, whatever. As long as it comes back 'new and improved' one day that's the important thing. However, I would very much like to see Papagayo's rebuilt soon and expanded. I realize that there wouldn't be the steady flow of people around because the cabins aren't there (nor is Alamanda, etc.), but bringing back Papagayo's first would have many, many benefits.

But, it would need to be expanded from just a clothing optional sit down restaurant to something more. A large outdoor patio with a bar would be a must, and for those wanting to grab a bite inside the restaurant could be rebuilt with both clothing-optional and textile sides. Visitors to Orient Beach from cruise ships, etc. would be curious and many would give a place like this a try. Chair and umbrella rentals could the be added (Cedric?) and even a small gift shop. Then, when the resort returns some day more people will be familiar with the area and possibly consider staying here. The need to keep this area relevant and attractive to future generations could be enhanced by this. Heck, if they even wanted to change the name from 'Papagayo's' to something like the 'Club Orient Bar & Grille' I'd be okay with that!

Sammy-Sorry, no, there will not be a clothing optional and textile side at any future rebuilt Club O. Club O has ALWAYS been clothing OPTIONAL, which means, OPTIONAL. You don't have to wear clothes. That's what it means.

Oh, I agree Carol. Very familiar with c/o approach! Just trying to think of anyone or any family that would prefer a 'textiled' approach. Although Papagayo's was always fairly crowded when we went there in the past, there's no question that some visitors stayed away because they didn't want to have lunch sitting at a table next to naked people. Of course, those people can eat and drink at places like Kontiki, Kakao, etc. Just trying to think of ways to bring the southern end of Orient Beach back to life. Whatever the plan, getting Papagayo's fixed and up-and-running again would be a real positive step. We'll be there in early March and I plan to walk through the 'ruins' of this place and try not to get too sad.

Why does the term "textiles" continue to be used? Same with the term "nudies".

In an earlier post you stated: "clothing-optional and textile sides."

As Carol stated, clothing optional is clothing optional. Why is the term "textiles" ok for some? How about "textile optional" if you want to continue to use it?

I agree with Carol. I don't like the idea of a section where one couldn't go unless they were "clad". The rest of the island is like that, and as a true naturist's resort, it's what set Club Orient apart. As far as changing the name, it isn't Papagayo's, it's simply Papagayo. But, thanks for your input.

In order to get Papagayo back the infrastructure would have to be there. I understand the electricity was demolished and other things not in working order. On a little different note, how does one get to the Perch Lite? Where can you park presently? Do you have to park where Pedro’s was?

You approach pedro’s (What’s left, nothing but some concrete) on the road to club O. The old wall thatnhidmclub Omfrommthe road is gone. You can park in the lot where Pedro’s was or you turn right before Pedro’s onto club O property and there is a large sand parking area right next to perch lite which is somewhat far off the waterline compared to pre-Irma. They try to keep cars parked close together to maximize spaces. The bathrooms are in this parking lot.

The South end of Orient Beach is already back to life and has been since the Perch Lite opened in November 17!

Points are well taken but " a textile side " in the restuarant? Really ? Club O is a C/O resort. You are either comfortable with that or you can take advantage of the textile facilities which comprise the majority of the island. Cheers

It was also mentioned in one of the early post Irma news letters from Club O, that Papagayo would not be rebuilt until they had rental units up and running to support it.

I've read through a lot of the responses. Quick recap= "Yes we'd go back, St. Martin is SO wonderful; We're not CO'ers, so yes we'd go back; Great food, shopping, multicultural, great beaches, so yes we'd go back." In my opinion, there are LOTS of great beaches in the Caribbean, there are LOTS of different cultures in the Caribbean. There is also LOTS of shopping in the Caribbean. The one differentiator is St. Martin is the premiere CO destination in terms of number of beaches and accepting attitudes. If it weren't for that I would likely not return year after year, I would sample other islands. Now technically, the original post asked about Club Orient. I never chosen to stay there (overpriced, underly luxurious) but it will remain to be seen that IF Club Orient stays away, whether the prevailing attitudes on the island will change towards CO tourism. I always felt, Club Orient was the "leader" and most visible advocate for CO'ers. Without Club O, hopefully SXM will not discount the THOUSANDS of CO tourists who stay in timeshares and villas all over the island, many of whom visit beaches other than the one end of Orient.

Our first trip to SXM was back in 2005 we stayed at Mt Vernon didn’t even know what Club O was
Our first morning walking the beach we sure learned in a hurry
It truly was an eye opener and shock
Since we were there for three weeks we slowly made our way down to that end of the beach
Finally getting to the point might as well try it
The people were amazing a truly life changing experience and mental realignment
These people were not perverts and so on they were some of the nicest non judgmental people I’ve ever met
After several trips we finally stayed at Club O for the convenience and the fact I won’t drink and drive
We met some awesome people great staff and truly miss Club O
With it not being there we have traveled to other places we always wanted to go but we’re always drawn back because of the diversity of the island the double culture fantastic dining great great entertainment and great beaches and the one thing that sets SXM apart and above all the other islands one of the best nude beaches in the world
Would we return to SXM without Club O
Yes would it be as special no it will have lost a bit of it’s appeal
We actually stopped in there in January and drove around the island
stopping by Orient Beach
We both had tears in our eyes all day
We hope it all gets rebuilt asap

Of course I’d go, as we’re not basing the trip around the resort.

Not to mention, all I do naked is shower lol