If not the BVI, then where?

We are a family of 5 (kids ages 9-14) who love the BVI.

Next April we are looking to try a new cruising area. I know this is heresy given how we all love the BVI!

We like to stay on mooring balls (can do the hook, prefer balls, do not like slips)

We spend most of our time in the water exploring. Land activities nice, not a must.

Less built up the better.


Thinking Abacos, but would like to hear from you and your
ideas for this type of crew and time of year.

Thanks!

As far as easy cruising, line of site, mooring balls, BVI is the most convenient. I never chartered in the Bahamas, have sailed there and anchoring is prevalent. We just did the Leewards and also anchoring is everywhere, mostly very easy holding. Loved St.Martin, but the checking in and out from French to Dutch and back is a real PITA, especially the French side.

We would love to try the Abacos sometime as well - from what I have been told and have read, a catamaran is the best option there.

The Grenadines are another area we'd really like to try.

I don't think there is anywhere else in the world that makes sailing as easy as in the BVI. I've been to most of the great cruising areas in the world (with the exception of the Bahamas!) and haven't found anywhere that has the combination of pretty much guaranteed good sailing weather, sheltered water, short distances between stops and mooring balls everywhere.

In the Caribbean, only the Grenadines comes close and they still require far more effort and anchoring to get to the best places.

Have to admit I'm surprised by sail2wind's comments about French customs. In my experience they are the easiest as you can fill the forms in online - often just in cyber cafes - so you don't need to actually see a customs official.

We haven't tried the Bahamas but would like to - I understand from reading the weather in the winter can be cool if a cild front passes by and the waters are rather shallow. We've sailed the windwards, Greece and Antigua. Loved them all for different reasons but Antigua is good as far as easy access by big jets. We also like the SVI islands of Culebra and Vieques.

Mike, we checked into Marigot twice and the guy was a jerk. Check in fee was 5 Euros or $9, we sad the exchange rate was 1-1 and he said"not here." On line check in is further south.

Hi Evan... In Marigot we used the marina office in Fort Louis. Thinking back though it may be you could only clear in there if you were staying in the marina. Not a problem for us as we did stay there pretty often so the staff knew us.

Pretty certain I also cleared in at the other marina even though we never stayed there.

If you mean the ferry dock customs then, yes, I agree. Best avoided.

Do a one way from St. Lucia to Grenada. Some open ocean sailing, nice anchorages, decent food opportunities. The only down side are the Boat Boys that can be a PITA, but just resolve yourself to dealing with them politely.

How about the USVI? St. John has $15 mooring balls. Not crowded... if you want an adventure, leave the from the south Shore of STJ early and go to St Croix. I've also chartered St. Vincent and the Grenadines. Another good option, but you'll be using the hook as there aren't many mooring balls.

Some of the boat boys can be the PITA you mention, but if you get the guy we used it was fantastic. Wish I could remember his name, it was a while ago. Brought us ice blocks made from, I assume, kettles at home. Took our clothes in and had them laundered. Brought us a great lobster dinner. Had a couple of beers with him, interesting stories. Got to go with the flow a bit.

Anyone wanting to do the windwards should look for a blog called "the usual suspects", I think it's still around. The guy bought a used charter boat and wrote a lot of good stuff about the area and he has a fresh perspective on the boat boys. We found a few spots a little annoying just because of the sheer number of them but other than that they were nice and they do provide some value to boaters.

April fly to St. Vincent and charter there, St. Lucia is another option with more air options that could make your sailing more extensive. There is nothing easier than the BVI. I am sure to get flamed here but the BVI has everything right there for you. The BVI could be compared to shopping in the mall. Easy parking, everything right there for you, the food court and crowds too. The other options will have much longer real sailing and you will need to do your homework. In general outside of the BVI we only more the boat every other day. Sail one day, explore the island the next.... repeat. Suggest two days at the Tabago Cay Park. Expect to be more handy on the boat. Service Calls will be few and far between, older boats will more actual sailing miles. Stuff will break and you should be ready to do basic fix/patch. We chartered just about everywhere else until we had small children to consider. The short protected predicable hops seem to work better with the smaller kids. The kids are older and have clearly figured out now the food on any of the french islands is far, far, better. Really almost anywhere the food is better than the BVI and Florida.

Do you mean overall or do you mean the sailing only? Since chartering in the BVI for two years I would like to find a different place to explore simply for a change of pace and because travelling to the BVI seems like such a hassle. I would have to think that travel to the Bahamas, St. Martin, etc would have to be easier. As far as sailing, it doesn't seem that Marsh Harbor/Abaco would be very difficult at all. But I have not sailed there...yet.

We did the Abacos years ago. Beautiful place-nice people, but VERY shallow. Spent too much time waiting for tides to rise.

This scares the hell out of me.

I actually agree with StormJib in some ways.

I was thinking the same thing Rick.

You can move from one end of the BVI to the other in less than a day and less than 25 miles. Many hops are closer to 5 miles. There is a massive BVI charter fleet and huge support system for those boats and very inexperience crews coupled with a few who know what they are doing in unprotected waters. Before you venture outside of the BVI make sure you note the weather range for your travel dates and the support system coupled with the standard of care for the rental fleets. We have done the Bahamas twice on charter boat. I do not think we will go back on a rental boat. We will visit the french islands, Grenadines, and BVI again. Does the crew want to sit, sail, or chase beach bars? We have found St. Martin, St. Barts, and Antigua not worth the trouble of dragging a boat with us.

I really enjoyed the Grenadines. Didn't find the boat boys to be much of an issue. The one hang up for me was the travel time/expense to get there from DC.

StormJib, are you implying that it is simply more efficient to visit these islands via a land-based trip? Or that the logistics of sailing at those locations is just a pain? After 10+ charters in the BVIs and recently spending three weeks down there, we too are looking for new sailing grounds. We have sailed the SVIs and USVIs, so we were thinking of a one-way from Antigua to St. Martin for our next trip, stopping at the three islands you mentioned as well as Barbuda, St. Kitts and Nevis. Looks like nice beam or broad reach sailing for the most part with many different islands to see. Would doing the one-way change your opinion about sailing the islands you mentioned?

Like the OP, we are a family of five with almost the same age kids. I figured a one-way charter would offer us the opportunity to see a little of each island over a roughly two week period, but with the opportunity to move on if we get bored. Kind of embarrassing to admit, but my family does get bored rather easily and while we like some beach time, we also like a little infrastructure and options while vacationing. As nice as the BVIs are, after a while the beaches, bars, restaurants, shopping, etc... all start to seem the same. Maybe an Antigua-St. Martin trip would offer up a little more variety?

To the OP, if you haven't been to the SVIs yet they might be the perfect next step. Fly to San Juan and charter out of Fajardo for easy and relatively cheap travel. There are some mooring balls, but you would be anchoring a fair amount. No slips though once you leave the main island. Plenty to explore and see, and the USVI is within range if you want to change it up a bit. If you have a little time before or after the charter there is plenty to see and do in Puerto Rico as well (rain forest, Old San Juan, etc...). Never have sailed the Abacos so I can't compare to it.

If you are willing to go a bit far afield, I have two suggerstion.
The first is Bay of Islands in New Zealand. We spent a week there and loved it. The water is cold so you may want to rent wet suits, but the area is largely protected and offers great sailing and many options for anchorage.
The second out of the way location is Paraty's Bay off the coast of Brazil, south of Rio.
The bay is sheltered by Ilha Grande so that sailing within the bay is quite comfortable. When we were there it was fairly choppy but well worth it. They have some very good anchorages and Ilha Grande is home to a perfect post card former fishing village, now a local tourist destination. Offering great food and shoping, It is one of the nicest places on earth that we have visited. And, the water is warm. Here is a link that further describes the sailing in the area: http://www.charterworld.com/?sub=brazil-yacht-charter
While we have not sailed there, we also here great things about Tonga.
You will be on a hook most, if not all of the time at these locations, but if you want beauty and solitude, they are three good options.

We've done the USVI, SVI, SXM, Grenadines.
Those are listed in increasing order of sailing difficulty.

Its all about the attitude! If you are looking for that secluded anchorage and self-sufficiency then the boat boys will disrupt that vibe, but if you embrace their help and assistance, my experience on three trips was all positive. Yes, while I am heading to a mooring ball that is free that I have clearly decided I want I dont need someone to say let me show you the best one but so what, he help with the procedure and asked if we wanted ice or reservations somewhere or anything else and was polite and we chatted for maybe 5 mins each time, gave them like $10 or $20 dollars depending and then we were left alone for the rest of the evening. Def not a reason not to go to Grenadines - can be annoyance (like any street peddler but Tabago Cay aint no Canal street) but turn it into a positive to learn about a new culture.

If you want to stay in the USA, try Maine, Chesapeake Bay or the San Juan Islands. Maine is beautiful, but with a short sailing season. The three hazards in Maine are lobster traps, rocks and fog. Most all of the charter boats have chart plotters on them to help with the navigation, some with RADAR. It is prudent to build in a couple lay days in case the fog is really thick and you don't feel safe to move around. You can buy live lobsters at most marinas for cheap!

The Chesapeake Bay offers a wide variety of sailing venues and I would recommend making St. Michaels a must stop. The weather here can be a bit dicey with T-Storms. Just remember that if your boat gets hit by lightening, and you are still alive, don't move - you've got a good spot! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Yikes.gif" alt="" />

The San Juan Islands are also cool cruising grounds. The area gets fog, too. Also, you need to mind the currents in some spots. Other than that, navigation is pretty straight forward and the islands are close together.

More

snmhanson... Starting from Antigua, I recommend...

South to Deshaies on Guadeloupe, then to my favourite place in all the Caribbean, Isles des Saintes at the southern end of Guadeloupe.

Then head west to Montserrat... an incredible experience seeing the effect of the volcano.

Then Nevis.

Then St Kitts.

Then head north to St Barts... should be the best beam reach ever.

Finally to St Martin (just the French side) Marigot, Grand Case.

That route will give you massive variety and, as long as the kids are happy sailing, no chance of being bored.

Not sure if you saw my Abacos report and video from earlier in the year. Shout if I can help with any questions.

Abacos and BVI Comparisons

Abacos 2015 Video

We're with Twanger but will add to the end of his list, Fiji and Tonga as far as "must have" overall sailing knowledge but well worth it!!!

Thank you for all the helpful information!

Definitely gives us a toe hold with our research.

Cheers,

We've also discussed getting some peeps together for Belize...we have been there on a non-sailing trip and LOVED it.

We cruised Belize on a 4 year old decrepit moorings cat. All of there boats were in bad shape. The charts were out of date and provisions were merely adequate.The area is rugged, navigation tricky and very undeveloped. The reefs are incredible and its the opposite of crowded.

But that was almost 10 years ago!



Belize is wonderful, but it made me return to the Bvi.

Thanks for that great report and comparison. I have travelled to the Bahamas land-based a couple of times but it was always the larger more developed islands and I was less than impressed. But I still want to try a sailing vacation there and my wife and I are considering that for next year.

So is it fair to say that sailing the Abaco Island area would be more comparable to sailing to and from an Anegada sort of place every day? Low-lying, sandy cays with shallow water and reefs.

A little bit of of a trek but Consider Croatia. I sailed from Dubrovnik to Split several weeks ago and hit 4 or 5 islands along the way. Nice sailing and friendly folks that (most) speak English.

Any thoughts on Îles des Saintes?

des Saintes is a French San Pedro, Belize, only with motor scooters instead of golf carts, and great French food, really nice people. Terre-de-Base is worth a day trip...

If you're lucky! Practice your German (presuming you dont speak Croatian). I love Croatia biut be aware that the climate is definitely no where near Caribbean. We literally experienced four seasons In a day (including snow) in early September, I truly want to return to this beautiful area, but it is NOT an easy alternative to anywhere in the Caribbean. Also you need specific sailing qualifications or else you need a 'captain'.

LOVE "Isles Des Saintes"..think it must be like St Barth's 30/40 years ago..charming..wonderful..friendly..and..oh the food!

Kimmers, we are planning a land based trip to Fiji in January. We would love make it a sailing trip, but that seems to be really limited. Do you have any contacts for captained or bareboat boats in Fiji?

None of the big bareboat players are present in Fiji, probably as a result of the relatively recent military coups. Although Fiji is now a democracy, the last military coup was in 2006 so it can't really be regarded as a stable place to do business.

Having said that, it is a wonderful place to visit ( I spent several weeks there, on my own boat, back in 2011) and there is a big cruising community. It is particularly popular with Australians and New Zealander's so you might find more info if you can find travel boards from those two countries.

Thanks Mike.

We love sailing I the BVIs and the Abacos. Here are the differences:


- Abacos can be chilly in the wintertime, and hotter in the spring and summer - same latitude as South Florida.
- winds not nearly as good in Abacos, on average, as the BVIs, although last year we had rippin' sustained 35 knot winds for 6 days. But prepare for very light winds also
- Abacos has much better beaches and incredible snorkeling.
- our whole crew bought a week's WiFi package from Bahamas WiMax and none of us could get connected the whole week. Total ripoff.
- restaurant selection and quality are way better in the BVIs.
- the shallow water at low tide in the Abacos just requires more attention to the charts and tide tables, not a big deal for a good skipper.
- same with anchoring.
- visually, the mountains and scenery in the BVIs is much superior, but the water clarity and color in the Abacos is spectacular.
- flights from West Palm Beach are much less expensive and easier than getting to and from Tortola.

Hope this helps. both places are great.