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Delta bans support puppies and kittens #177812
12/12/2018 01:09 AM
12/12/2018 01:09 AM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,698
Auburn, WA
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Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177822
12/12/2018 07:31 AM
12/12/2018 07:31 AM
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Sandandsun Offline
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I’m not sure what this has to do specifically with St Martin but I’d say in general it’s good news.

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: Sandandsun] #177823
12/12/2018 07:34 AM
12/12/2018 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Sandandsun
I’m not sure what this has to do specifically with St Martin but I’d say in general it’s good news.

Delta is one of the 3-4 primary carriers to St. Maarten.

Good move on Delta's part.


J.D.
Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: ruralcarrier] #177824
12/12/2018 07:42 AM
12/12/2018 07:42 AM
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Uksimonusa Offline
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Originally Posted by ruralcarrier
Originally Posted by Sandandsun
I’m not sure what this has to do specifically with St Martin but I’d say in general it’s good news.

Delta is one of the 3-4 primary carriers to St. Maarten.

Good move on Delta's part.



Good move on Delta's part, yes, but they don't have many flight to St Maarten that are over 8 hours, so not really relevant to SXM

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: Sandandsun] #177825
12/12/2018 07:43 AM
12/12/2018 07:43 AM
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Unless you have an emotional support peacock, small horse, goat or pig, then its bad.


Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: Uksimonusa] #177826
12/12/2018 08:26 AM
12/12/2018 08:26 AM
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Ohio
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Originally Posted by Uksimonusa
Originally Posted by ruralcarrier
Originally Posted by Sandandsun
I’m not sure what this has to do specifically with St Martin but I’d say in general it’s good news.

Delta is one of the 3-4 primary carriers to St. Maarten.

Good move on Delta's part.



Good move on Delta's part, yes, but they don't have many flight to St Maarten that are over 8 hours, so not really relevant to SXM

A more detailed article that addresses ESA animals UNDER 4 months of age and ALL Delta flights so it could easily pertain to St. Maarten.

ARTICLE

"As a result of the policy changes, customers ticketed on or after Dec. 18 will no longer be permitted to originate travel with emotional-support animals on flights longer than eight hours and will no longer be permitted to originate travel with service and support animals under four months of age regardless of flight length."

Like with many well intentioned laws, the ADA law is so loosely worded it is very easy to buy a $49 vest on the internet and pass off about any animal as a Service/ESA to take advantage of many situations.

As one who travels by car with a dog(s) a lot and stays in hotels, we see it way too often. The ones who actually follow the law and the people who have a TRUE Service Dog often pay the price for the imposters.


J.D.
Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177827
12/12/2018 08:30 AM
12/12/2018 08:30 AM
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Hershey, Pennsylvania
Tom Offline
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Add to this the "peanut allergy" policy from American Airlines that goes into effect today that allows anyone who claims that they have that allergy to early boarding so that they can clean the area around their seat. I know that allergies can be serious but why do I suspect that some people will not be honest about this?

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: Tom] #177828
12/12/2018 08:35 AM
12/12/2018 08:35 AM
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Ohio
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You can bet on the fact, it will be abused.


J.D.
Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: Tom] #177842
12/12/2018 11:02 AM
12/12/2018 11:02 AM
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I have a serious cat allergy. I like em but them make it very hard to breathe and i have to leave when they are close by. I will almost always develop bronchitis after exposure. Do i get a certified cat free zone/plane section?

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: PelicanPirate] #177843
12/12/2018 11:24 AM
12/12/2018 11:24 AM
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Central Florida!
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Pelican--just curious, have you called ahead of time, or checked when you arrive at the airport, to see if anyone will have a cat near your seat? Would they give you that information?


Carol Hill
Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177849
12/12/2018 11:48 AM
12/12/2018 11:48 AM
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Posts: 355
Sarasota, Florida
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It is amazing how the minority of people have started ruling what the majority does. I have sympathy for those with anxiety, peanut allergies, and any other "disorder" that some psychologist/psychiatrist has placed upon them but I, nor anyone else, should have to be denied the ability to travel comfortably.

These folks need to find alternative measures for travel. I realize that there are some occasions when these people have to fly but when there are other options available, then they need to use them. It is a shame that in the process of accommodating a select few with actual issues, the unscrupulous without issues will use these "loopholes" to their benefit.

So if 1 person on the plane has a peanut allergy does this mean the other 150 or so others can't get a bag of nuts to enjoy with their glass of diet Coke. Or the 1 person that has anxiety about flying and brings a dog/cat as their emotional support which causes another(s) on that plane to suffer because those people have pet allergies. What about those with pet allergies who get on that plane AFTER that emotional support animal departs but, as we all know the animal hair and/or dander is left behind, starts having a reaction to the allergen?

Here's an idea, change the HIIPA laws to allow common carriers to require proof of the disorder and that the animal is certified in that field. If there is an allergen alleged, then allow the common carrier to require that the allergen is a life threatening allergy and require that passenger to carry an antidote such as an epi-pen.

I realize that there aren't many international means of travel other than air travel but I think it would behoove the airlines to only allow these people to board flights that actually depart from US soil or arrive 1st on US soil. If you are one of these people that have these issues and live in an area when you don't have non-stop out of the US, I feel for you but IMHO you should rent a car to drive to the departing airport that services your final international destination and when you arrive back in the US then use that rental car to drive from the arrival airport. Yes this may seem harsh to some but it's truly getting out of hand.

I feel for Pelican because I would hate to have to worry that I'll be 35,000 feet over an ocean when my breathing becomes labored because of someone's anxiety alleviating cat has shed enough hair/dander to cause that allergic reaction. Lord knows airplanes are not set up to handle true medical emergencies and the 30+ minutes it would take to get that aircraft on the ground to meet an EMS crew could mean a very dire result for people like Pelican.

Unfortunately there are those that will abuse the system for their own benefit. Other than true service animals (seeing eye dog, seizure dog, diabetic dog etc). there should be a very strict policy to get any animal on the plane.


Last edited by deputydog1157; 12/12/2018 11:49 AM. Reason: double word


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Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177851
12/12/2018 11:55 AM
12/12/2018 11:55 AM
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CJIMI Offline
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Remember the story about the "support pig" who got loose on a USAir flight from PHL to Seattle ?

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177853
12/12/2018 12:28 PM
12/12/2018 12:28 PM
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irina Offline
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I agree with Deputy Dog. As a member of the Board of Directors of our condo, I hear all sorts of stories about emotional support animals.
One person gave us a letter from AZ, from someone, not a doctor, with a license # in CA of a real doctor. And that license had lapsed.
All this because she didn't want to pay the pet fee! Ridiculous.
We only allow one pet, so of course we had someone apply for an emotional support dog for their emotional support dog.
Another "emotional support" pit bull lunged at me, coming out of the elevator.
It's gotten so out of hand. A real support dog is highly trained and does not lunge, defecate or bark. It sits quietly with his/her charge and watches over everything.
You are not even supposed to pet a support dog.

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: deputydog1157] #177854
12/12/2018 12:47 PM
12/12/2018 12:47 PM
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Quote
Here's an idea, change the HIIPA laws to allow common carriers to require proof of the disorder and that the animal is certified in that field. If there is an allergen alleged, then allow the common carrier to require that the allergen is a life threatening allergy and require that passenger to carry an antidote such as an epi-pen.


And also the ADA regulations with regard to proof and what can and can not be asked. Sadly, once any law is enacted and the entitlements begin, good luck on ever changing it.

I have know a mid-30's who had multiple Service/Seizure Alert dogs. They can only work so long and have to be retired and not all make it, even after extensive training. The training these dogs go through and the expense and training the family go through is substantial but they did it the right way and through an organization.

We have been around true service dogs many times, unless they are actually working, you hardly know they are there. At a restaurant the dog will lay under the table at the handlers feet and most never know the dog is there unless they see it walk in. Contrast that with the untrained (for true service dog work) family pet and that someone turns into a "service dog" and it is pretty easy to spot the fakes.

Nowadays someone can buy a "service dog" kit on the internet and due to the restriction of what can or can't be be asked, the untrained family pet gets the owners the benefits that come with a true service dog.


J.D.
Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: deputydog1157] #177857
12/12/2018 01:30 PM
12/12/2018 01:30 PM
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Didn't you know that minority rules In the US?

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: LBI2SXM] #177859
12/12/2018 02:25 PM
12/12/2018 02:25 PM
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Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline
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OK, let's get back on track to the original topic, folks, or we will close this one.


Carol Hill
Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: Carol_Hill] #177863
12/12/2018 03:21 PM
12/12/2018 03:21 PM
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Hadnt really been a problem. Havent seen many. Every once in awhile you here a meow from a carrier. But technically, if one were next to me for a flight to LAX or Europe it might not be a good start. Especially, if they were peeking out and being petted.

I would ask for me or the other person to be relocated.

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: deputydog1157] #177866
12/12/2018 04:02 PM
12/12/2018 04:02 PM
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Just curious, but why is your comfort more important than someone else's? Does your desire for peanuts really rank higher than someone's allergy
to them? Are you really put out by not being able to eat peanuts for a few hours verses their inability to travel without risking anaphylactic shock?
People with life-threatening allergies like to go to places like St. Martin as well.

We can have a reasonable debate on emotional support animals, but sulking over peanuts seems to be a bit on the selfish side...

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177868
12/12/2018 04:30 PM
12/12/2018 04:30 PM
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Massachusetts
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Thread is about support animals so I will ignore the peanut issue but I do think that totally eliminating peanuts is not an earth shattering crisis....but back to topic ..., ANYONE can designate their pet as an emotional support animal to avoid paying the $100 fee each way for a flight. This is really is sad for those who really need them. The system is flawed just by the fact that there are presently over 300 listing for "support animal vests" on Ebay....$19.95 saves you $200

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: boucharda] #177869
12/12/2018 04:56 PM
12/12/2018 04:56 PM
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I agree whole-heartedly on this. Emotional Support animals should be categorized the same as other service animals; fully trained and
licensed.

My cat is definitely an "emotional support" animal, but if I ever need to take him on a plane he's going in a carrier, under the seat,
and appropriately paid for (where no doubt he would howl the whole flight. There is a reason he doesn't travel with me! jester).

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177870
12/12/2018 05:19 PM
12/12/2018 05:19 PM
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I can identify with that....We drive with our cat from MA to SW Fl every winter and stay at LaQuinta on the trip because of their no charge for pets policy. I guess I could get a $19.95 vest and not worry about where to stay..but...it's not my M.O.

Hmmm.... would hotels with a no pet policy (or $75/stay) defer to an free emotional support cat?

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177871
12/12/2018 05:57 PM
12/12/2018 05:57 PM
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Med/ Caribbean
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Colorado now allows business owners to deny pets/emotional support animals and may impose a hefty fine for abusers.
Service animals are allowed with current certification, that provide a specific task for a person with a defined need. About time.

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: sailbynight] #177873
12/12/2018 07:05 PM
12/12/2018 07:05 PM
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Auburn, WA
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The way it should be.

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: jenniboston] #177881
12/12/2018 11:16 PM
12/12/2018 11:16 PM
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Hershey, Pennsylvania
Tom Offline
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You completely missed my point.
No one is "sulking over peanuts", there is no dispute that allergies can be serious conditions.
But establishing an airline policy that allows everyone that claims, without any proof, that they have a peanut allergy so that they can board the flight early is very wrong.
Unfortunately, some people will go to great lengths to get on the plane early including inventing an allergy.
Would it not make more sense to encourage those with a potential problem to inform those around them after they are seated?

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: Tom] #177882
12/12/2018 11:46 PM
12/12/2018 11:46 PM
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Auburn, WA
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The early boarding is provided to allow the passenger to "clense" the sitting area of potential alergens. Nothing to stop any others from partaking in eating nuts or any other offensive foods. Lot can be said about offensive perfumes and body order too.

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177893
12/13/2018 10:41 AM
12/13/2018 10:41 AM
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This is from the, allergicliving.com website: If a peanut allergic person breathes enough of the peanut protein in the air, the person can have a serious allergic reaction, asthma attack or anaphylaxis.

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: Tom] #177900
12/13/2018 11:43 AM
12/13/2018 11:43 AM
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Everyone with special needs should have to produce a letter from a doctor stating the actual problem. This would prevent people taking advantage of any rules . No letter, no special treatment. No exceptions!




Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: islandgem] #177911
12/13/2018 01:01 PM
12/13/2018 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by islandgem
Everyone with special needs should have to produce a letter from a doctor stating the actual problem. This would prevent people taking advantage of any rules . No letter, no special treatment. No exceptions!

Good idea but like with disabilities (at least here in the US), find the right doctor and/or lawyer (sorry Carol) and you are set. One of the lawyers I know from wine tasting specializes in this.


J.D.
Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMScubaman] #177921
12/13/2018 03:53 PM
12/13/2018 03:53 PM
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Sarasota, Florida
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Maybe the airlines will get the clue if all the other 150 passengers get off the plane when they see a bogus support animal saying they have an allergy to that type of animal.



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Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: ruralcarrier] #177923
12/13/2018 04:13 PM
12/13/2018 04:13 PM
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Have a ban/exception list of what can/cannot be brought on the plane without prior airline approval, CHARGE for the plane ride for the animal, the animal has to be in some sort of containment, AND let the passenger know the the animal might have to ride below deck. The passenger would have to acknowledge this at time of ticket purchase.


The animal not riding in the lap of the passenger and having to pay for the ride should resolve a lot of this.

Wendell

Re: Delta bans support puppies and kittens [Re: SXMWendell] #177925
12/13/2018 04:23 PM
12/13/2018 04:23 PM
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I don't think an animal in a carrier below the seat or below deck would do any good as an emotional support animal during the flight


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