Traveltalkonline.com Forums


BVI Cruise Schedule TTOL Sponsors BVI Travel Calendar
Forum Statistics
Forums39
Topics38,433
Posts310,108
Members26,538
Most Online2,218
Jan 21st, 2020
Top Posters(30 Days)
RonDon 115
pat 42
jazzgal 40
Todd 40
Member Spotlight
kim
kim
Newtown, CT
Posts: 4,673
Joined: September 2000
Show All Member Profiles 
Today's Birthdays
LONGISLANDSHARON, Sca2la
Who's Online Now
26 registered members (Whale Tail, SXMScubaman, PML, xrayman67, YachtReprise, ambmike, JeanneB, jrw, Instigator, NumberCruncher, Lionsail, eightzerobits, OceanSong, Zanshin, jeepers, RatmansWife, SteveH, SURICK, MNsnowbird, cabokid, botnot, 5 invisible), 921 guests, and 62 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Airport Expansion #112767
11/21/2016 11:22 AM
11/21/2016 11:22 AM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,169
Rincón PR
casailor53 Offline OP
Traveler
casailor53  Offline OP
Traveler
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,169
Rincón PR
VINO story today
Not a fan of Bishop Cline, but he appears to have gotten on Glenn's bus.

BVI Sponsors
Re: Airport Expansion [Re: casailor53] #112768
11/21/2016 12:42 PM
11/21/2016 12:42 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 17,029
Tortola/ Sonoma, California
Manpot Offline
Traveler
Manpot  Offline
Traveler
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 17,029
Tortola/ Sonoma, California
Suggest Glenn gets copy of his outline to him..he has hit the nail on the head..for a change..

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: Manpot] #112769
11/21/2016 01:19 PM
11/21/2016 01:19 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,994
GA/NC
GeorgeC1 Offline
Traveler
GeorgeC1  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,994
GA/NC
Glenn for Minister of transportation!!
G

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: GeorgeC1] #112770
11/21/2016 03:34 PM
11/21/2016 03:34 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
S
StormJib Offline
Traveler
StormJib  Offline
Traveler
S
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
The only flaw in business case to put a BVI Welcome Service in at STT that whisks visitors arriving by air in good comfort to a nice hassle free welcome to a Tortola visitor transportation hub is. The powers that be at STT and on St. Thomas want NO part of it. Then you have the problem of the entrenched ferry operators.

In any case anyone arriving by air should be cleared from the passenger manifest before the plane lands and should only be stopped by C&I for cause. That is how you welcome visitors. Every BVI minister should be given a paid trip to Denmark to see how a welcome service can be operated.

While we are at it can we simply merge the governments and tribes of Tortola and St. Thomas?

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: StormJib] #112771
11/21/2016 04:48 PM
11/21/2016 04:48 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,999
Macon, Georgia
GlennA Offline
Traveler
GlennA  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,999
Macon, Georgia
Blyden Terminal IS the defacto "Tortola Visitor Transportation Hub". The major challenge on the STT side is the airport and ferry terminal taxi associations but I believe a bit of negotiation could eliminate that.

My proposal does not eliminate the existing ferry operators but presents a way for them to work together to finance a new fleet, reduce shore side fixed cost and boat operating costs, increase reservation rates and provide reliable convenient schedules. Everyone wins if a few people would just take their heads out of the sand and cooperate with each other.

Last edited by GlennA; 11/21/2016 04:49 PM.

Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. - Mark Twain
Re: Airport Expansion [Re: GlennA] #112772
11/21/2016 07:59 PM
11/21/2016 07:59 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
S
StormJib Offline
Traveler
StormJib  Offline
Traveler
S
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
Blyden Terminal IS the defacto "Tortola Visitor Transportation Hub" What I was trying to communicate was a central gathering hub to get to all the out islands in a convenient pleasurable experience. An operation that allows anyone traveling by at least air to bypass anything that looks like a C&I stop and frisk. A true Welcome to the BVI and your holiday. What is the future for a visitor traveling to Virgin Gorda? How long should that take after a plane lands at STT?

The current BVI plan is to create something like that at Beef Island/Trellis Bay complete with a visitor "museum"?

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: StormJib] #112773
11/22/2016 11:00 AM
11/22/2016 11:00 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 507
Here and There in Michigan
H
HoosierDaddy Offline
Traveler
HoosierDaddy  Offline
Traveler
H
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 507
Here and There in Michigan
All I want from BVI is a Better/Faster/Friendlier way to get through BVI C&I. Last several trips by Ferry to Road Town, we were cut in line by BVI locals but worse, it took 1-1/2 hours for us to get off the dock and through customs. I promised myself last mid January I would charter a boat out of St. Thomas next time unless things change with the way the BVI handles tourist passengers from St. Thomas.

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: HoosierDaddy] #112774
11/22/2016 01:47 PM
11/22/2016 01:47 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,901
Maine
Breeze Offline
Traveler
Breeze  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,901
Maine
Just do it. It's not difficult. Check in to BVi when you get there, check out when you leave. Stop in to Cruz Bay on the way back and declare you are coming home. Try it, you might like it.

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: HoosierDaddy] #112775
11/22/2016 09:49 PM
11/22/2016 09:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 304
California
Sunnykm Offline
Traveler
Sunnykm  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 304
California
We just got home from our trip. We came in on the Native Son ferry (what a horrible boat) and did the C&I in Road Town. It was our easiest clear in ever! They had Ambassadors to help (and very kindly) with the forms and the officers inside were efficient.

Karen

If all the ferries could be like the Providence (not sure what company but it was clean, had nice seats with tables, air conditioning and a snack bar) ferry we took back to STT, it would make for a much less stressful situation. But we took the first available on the way in and it was Native Son.

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: Sunnykm] #112776
11/23/2016 12:27 AM
11/23/2016 12:27 AM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,999
Macon, Georgia
GlennA Offline
Traveler
GlennA  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,999
Macon, Georgia
Provincetown III is leased for the season by Roadtown Fast Ferry. The crew is from the US and runs the boat year round. In the spring/summer Bay State Cruise Co owns it operates in the Boston/Provincetown market where you can't get away with running a shoddy ferry service.

THAT is the kind of boat and service that I proposed and will be needed for the BVI tourism industry to survive.

Last edited by GlennA; 11/23/2016 12:47 AM.

Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. - Mark Twain
Re: Airport Expansion [Re: GlennA] #112777
11/23/2016 09:56 AM
11/23/2016 09:56 AM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
S
StormJib Offline
Traveler
StormJib  Offline
Traveler
S
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
Is there a BVI company that runs passenger service between Tortola and St. Thomas or are all the ferry boats and operators really controlled by USVI entities? Does the stop on St. John require the ferries operators to be fully Jones Act compliant?

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: StormJib] #112778
11/23/2016 10:21 AM
11/23/2016 10:21 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,609
Woodstock, GA
RickinAtlanta Offline
Traveler
RickinAtlanta  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,609
Woodstock, GA
Quote
StormJib said:
Is there a BVI company that runs passenger service between Tortola and St. Thomas or are all the ferry boats and operators really controlled by USVI entities? Does the stop on St. John require the ferries operators to be fully Jones Act compliant?


I trust you're not talking about the "Davey Jones Act"?

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: RickinAtlanta] #112779
11/23/2016 12:15 PM
11/23/2016 12:15 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
S
StormJib Offline
Traveler
StormJib  Offline
Traveler
S
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
Quote
RickinAtlanta said:
Quote
StormJib said:
Is there a BVI company that runs passenger service between Tortola and St. Thomas or are all the ferry boats and operators really controlled by USVI entities? Does the stop on St. John require the ferries operators to be fully Jones Act compliant?


I trust you're not talking about the "Davey Jones Act"?


I am referring to our US laws that require you to use a US Vessel and Crew to move directly between two US Ports. That is one of the many critical problems that plague the economy of Puerto Rico.

Quote
The Jones Act when used in the sense of maritime law refers to federal statute 46 USC section 883.

Generally, the Jones Act prohibits any foreign built or foreign flagged vessel from engaging in coastwise trade within the United States. A number of other statutes affect coastwise trade and should be consulted along with the Jones Act. These include the Passenger Services Act, 46 USC section 289 which restricts coastwise transportation of passengers and 46 USC section 12108 restricts the use of foreign vessel to commercially catch or transport fish in U.S. waters.

The essential term that has given rise to various interpretations of what constitutes "coastwise trade". The federal courts have given a very wide interpretation of the term. Essentially the term applies to a voyage that beginning at any point within the United States and delivering a type of commercial cargo to any other point within the United States.


My question is what laws apply to a commercial vessel the travels the St. Thomas, to St. John, to Tortola route?

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: StormJib] #112780
11/23/2016 01:44 PM
11/23/2016 01:44 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,994
GA/NC
GeorgeC1 Offline
Traveler
GeorgeC1  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,994
GA/NC
The USVI is exempt from the Jones act.

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: GlennA] #112781
11/23/2016 01:51 PM
11/23/2016 01:51 PM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 304
California
Sunnykm Offline
Traveler
Sunnykm  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 304
California
Glenn

The difference between the two operators was night and day! It is truly a game changer for me if I knew that was what I could expect each time. Do any of the BVI government officers ever take a ferry??

I would rather fly into EIS but knowing there was a clean, comfortable, reliable ferry waiting makes it much more palatable.

Karen

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: StormJib] #112782
11/23/2016 04:51 PM
11/23/2016 04:51 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,609
Woodstock, GA
RickinAtlanta Offline
Traveler
RickinAtlanta  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,609
Woodstock, GA
Quote
StormJib said:
Quote
RickinAtlanta said:
Quote
StormJib said:
Is there a BVI company that runs passenger service between Tortola and St. Thomas or are all the ferry boats and operators really controlled by USVI entities? Does the stop on St. John require the ferries operators to be fully Jones Act compliant?


I trust you're not talking about the "Davey Jones Act"?


I am referring to our US laws that require you to use a US Vessel and Crew to move directly between two US Ports. That is one of the many critical problems that plague the economy of Puerto Rico.

Quote
The Jones Act when used in the sense of maritime law refers to federal statute 46 USC section 883.

Generally, the Jones Act prohibits any foreign built or foreign flagged vessel from engaging in coastwise trade within the United States. A number of other statutes affect coastwise trade and should be consulted along with the Jones Act. These include the Passenger Services Act, 46 USC section 289 which restricts coastwise transportation of passengers and 46 USC section 12108 restricts the use of foreign vessel to commercially catch or transport fish in U.S. waters.

The essential term that has given rise to various interpretations of what constitutes "coastwise trade". The federal courts have given a very wide interpretation of the term. Essentially the term applies to a voyage that beginning at any point within the United States and delivering a type of commercial cargo to any other point within the United States.


My question is what laws apply to a commercial vessel the travels the St. Thomas, to St. John, to Tortola route?


Oh but for a sense of humor... <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/jester.gif" alt="" />

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: GeorgeC1] #112783
11/23/2016 08:35 PM
11/23/2016 08:35 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,999
Macon, Georgia
GlennA Offline
Traveler
GlennA  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,999
Macon, Georgia
While all the ferries in service were built in the US, I believe Smiths is a USVI firm. Native Son and Caribbean Maratime Excursions (RTFF) are BVI. The Jones Act prohibits foreign flagged vessels from carrying passengers between US ports so USVI to BVI doesn't fall under the act. WE/Cruz Bay/Redhook may be a special acomodation due to location of the C&I locations. There can be special waivers. I believe the Vancouver/Bellingham route operates under one.


Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. - Mark Twain
Re: Airport Expansion [Re: GlennA] #112784
11/23/2016 10:50 PM
11/23/2016 10:50 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,994
GA/NC
GeorgeC1 Offline
Traveler
GeorgeC1  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,994
GA/NC
As I posted before the Jones act does not apply to the USVI. That is one of the complaints that Puerto Rico has been making. They want the same exemption.

Merchant Marine Act of 1920 Placed VI Outside US Custom Zone: The Merchant Marine Act of 1920 also knows as the Jones Act excluded the Virgin Islands from the application of all US coastal laws. Specifically, SEC. 21. COASTWISE LAWS EXTENDED TO ISLAND TERRITORIES AND POSSESSIONS (46 App. U.S.C. 877) states the following:
“And provided further, That the coastwise laws of the United States shall not extend to the Virgin Islands.

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: RickinAtlanta] #112785
11/24/2016 10:26 AM
11/24/2016 10:26 AM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 929
Knoxville, Tennessee
Fred Offline
Traveler
Fred  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 929
Knoxville, Tennessee
Rick,
I got it and most appropriate given the condition of many of the ferries. Good one.
Fred <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/jester.gif" alt="" />

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: Fred] #112786
11/24/2016 11:50 AM
11/24/2016 11:50 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,609
Woodstock, GA
RickinAtlanta Offline
Traveler
RickinAtlanta  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,609
Woodstock, GA
Quote
Fred said:
Rick,
I got it and most appropriate given the condition of many of the ferries. Good one.
Fred <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/jester.gif" alt="" />


Nothing like riding below on the Bomba Charger and seeing the fish swim by the window as we list to port! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Yikes.gif" alt="" />

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: RickinAtlanta] #112787
11/24/2016 12:07 PM
11/24/2016 12:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,347
USVI
LocalSailor Offline
Traveler
LocalSailor  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,347
USVI
I have visited the STT airport arrival terminal many times of late picking up friends returning home.
There is a very visible BVI welcome kiosk that is usually manned and open - the staff there has been friendly, smiling and knowledgeable.
I always make it a point to stop over there and say hello and have seen how helpful they are when a traveler stops by with any question or problem.

Re: Airport Expansion [Re: RickinAtlanta] #112788
11/24/2016 12:48 PM
11/24/2016 12:48 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,994
GA/NC
GeorgeC1 Offline
Traveler
GeorgeC1  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,994
GA/NC
I was on the charger once and we listed so far over the Captain yanked the engines out of gear and we hung with a huge list for probably 20 seconds. I was convinced it was going to roll and planning my exit strategy. So was the crew as several bailed out of the wheelhouse. We continued at a much slower pace after that.
What made me laugh was the BVI government had just required that all charter boats have a individual stability certificate and I had to pay big bucks out of pocket to have it done. The cat was 25' wide and 45' long!
G

Last edited by GeorgeC1; 11/24/2016 12:50 PM.
Re: Airport Expansion [Re: GeorgeC1] #112789
11/24/2016 02:57 PM
11/24/2016 02:57 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
S
StormJib Offline
Traveler
StormJib  Offline
Traveler
S
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
So what is the exact role of the BVI Government with the passenger ferries that travel between St. Thomas and the BVI Islands?

Last edited by StormJib; 11/24/2016 02:59 PM.
Re: Airport Expansion [Re: StormJib] #112790
11/24/2016 05:49 PM
11/24/2016 05:49 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,999
Macon, Georgia
GlennA Offline
Traveler
GlennA  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,999
Macon, Georgia
That, unfortunately, is the big question. As a vital transportation link, the BVI Ports Authority and the Ministry of Communications and Works have constitutional authority to regulate the ferry service but they seem to have totally abandoned all responsibility in that area.


Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. - Mark Twain
Jones Act v Passenger Vessel Services Act 1886 [Re: GlennA] #112791
11/25/2016 11:19 PM
11/25/2016 11:19 PM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,212
JAX
jphart Offline
Traveler
jphart  Offline
Traveler
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,212
JAX
The Jones Act does not apply to passengers. And It is only btwn US Ports
https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/24/~/the-jones-act,-passengers


JPH
I spent my money on booze, broads, and boats...the rest I wasted.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.1