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Topless on Dawn beach?? #130469
05/18/2017 08:26 PM
05/18/2017 08:26 PM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 6
KY
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StephKY Offline OP
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KY
Staying at Princess Heights near Dawn Beach in June. Is Dawn beach topless?
And if anyone has stayed at princess heights , what are your impressions about the property?
Thanks!

SXM Sponsors
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: StephKY] #130470
05/19/2017 01:32 PM
05/19/2017 01:32 PM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 563
Cobourg Ontario Canada
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jeepers Offline
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I don't believe there is anywhere on the Dutch side that topless is specifically allowed (some people do anyway) except for sunset bar & grill where if women went topless they got a free drink. Not sure if the rules have changed.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: jeepers] #130471
05/19/2017 02:59 PM
05/19/2017 02:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,143
Plaistow, New Hampshire
Paul_Marion Offline
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Plaistow, New Hampshire
Cupecoy.......


Remember the Monolith
Paul & Marion
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: StephKY] #130472
05/19/2017 03:06 PM
05/19/2017 03:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 65,517
Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline
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Central Florida!
While there could be occasional topless use on Dawn, I certainly would not count on it at all. With regard to Princess Heights, suggest you might want to post a separate note about that.


Carol Hill
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: StephKY] #130473
05/19/2017 03:24 PM
05/19/2017 03:24 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 3,755
Newtown, CT
kim Offline
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I'm confused. I won't touch the sunset thing. As that I find was wicked tacky and now with the new sunset can't imagine. But I'm pretty sure you can go topless on any beach on the Dutch or French side. I would use your on discretion and see what's appropriate for the situation. Beach crowd can change daily. It's not an uncommon thing to see bathers topess but then put their top on to swim or go eat. But I'm pretty sure it is not "illegal" to be topless on the Dutch side. Unless I missed something?

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: kim] #130474
05/19/2017 04:12 PM
05/19/2017 04:12 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,632
Boynton Beach, FL
EdB Offline
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Boynton Beach, FL
Honestly...I have seen topless just about at every beach on the island. Even at Maho...by the Sonesta and Royal Islander. It may not be prevalent...but every now and then someone decides to take off the top....and never have seen anyone tell them to cover up.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: EdB] #130475
05/19/2017 07:02 PM
05/19/2017 07:02 PM
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Posts: 402
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Over at our timeshare, we've seen people go topless at Royal Islander's section of Maho bay.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: DavidinChelseaMA] #130476
05/19/2017 08:20 PM
05/19/2017 08:20 PM
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 223
Kansas City Missouri
kccouple Online content
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You will have no problems going topless on any beach on St Martin...Sunday is family day at many beaches so you will see less topless on sunday

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: kccouple] #130477
05/19/2017 08:43 PM
05/19/2017 08:43 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,597
Sint Maarten
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After living there 20 years, really don't agree with that. Sorry. Many are family beaches, especially on the Dutch Side, and topless is offensive to many locals. Look around and do what is appropriate.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: jeepers] #130478
05/19/2017 09:27 PM
05/19/2017 09:27 PM
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In our one time eating lunch before flight at Karacter there was more than a half dozen ladies spread out amongst their chair locations sans tops and of a wide age range.

Seen topless many times at Mullet, usually young.

Don't know about Dawn.

Those are my two data points. <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif" alt="" />

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: kccouple] #130479
05/19/2017 09:27 PM
05/19/2017 09:27 PM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 563
Cobourg Ontario Canada
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jeepers Offline
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Cobourg Ontario Canada
I have seen security insist women put tops on at great bay beach.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: jeepers] #130480
05/20/2017 05:44 AM
05/20/2017 05:44 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 402
DavidinChelseaMA Offline
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Quote
jeepers said:
I have seen security insist women put tops on at great bay beach.


At Great Bay, that makes sense. It's a cruise ship docking locale and has lots of newbies and families, etc. And it's location is less secluded feeling. Maho is similar in its "feel", and also has it's families and cruise ship crowds, but the Sunset beach bar has, and still does have, an effect on Maho's vibe, with that bar's history of topless women getting free drinks. (Even though I don't think that's still the way they do things over there, since their renovation.)

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: DavidinChelseaMA] #130481
05/20/2017 06:20 AM
05/20/2017 06:20 AM
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,004
Ohio
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There was at least two women sitting at the original bar back in March and were topless.

I never really understand the desire to go against local customs and laws. Just because some people choose to do something does not make it right, legal or acceptable. I have witnessed women being told to put their tops back on when on Anguila.


J.D.
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: ruralcarrier] #130482
05/20/2017 08:04 AM
05/20/2017 08:04 AM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 240
South Coast of MA
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SXMBND Offline
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Quote
ruralcarrier said:
There was at least two women sitting at the original bar back in March and were topless.

I never really understand the desire to go against local customs and laws. Just because some people choose to do something does not make it right, legal or acceptable. I have witnessed women being told to put their tops back on when on Anguila.


<img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Thumbsup.gif" alt="" />
Like the nudity at Cupecoy.

Last edited by SXMBND; 05/20/2017 08:05 AM.
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: SXMBND] #130483
05/20/2017 08:25 AM
05/20/2017 08:25 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 11,650
Brookfield, CT.
pat Offline
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And then there's tradition.

We've been visiting the island annually since 1973 and while topless wasn't the norm on the Dutch beaches, Cupecoy was always the exception. There was NOTHING in this area and the beach access wasn't the easiest so almost anything was acceptable there from fully suited to buck naked and anything in between. It was a known tradition for that beach and everyone who might have something to say just looked the other way with regard to this one location. Basically, no harm, no foul. But you just knew, once the development of the area took place, people might agitate for changes in the tradition.

With regard to Sunset Beach Bar and 'drinking for free' - I've always wondered how that came about and whose palms were greased to allow it in the first place. <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/handshake.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/handshake.gif" alt="" />


Respectfully,

pat



"Always keep your words soft and sweet, just in case you have to eat
them."
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: SXMBND] #130484
05/20/2017 08:29 AM
05/20/2017 08:29 AM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 563
Cobourg Ontario Canada
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jeepers Offline
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<img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Thumbsup.gif" alt="" /> am I right that nudity is allowed at club Orient but because it's a public beach the powers that be could stop that if they want? I'm afraid that with people thinking they can do this everywhere that they will eventually say no nudity anywhere on the island??

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: jeepers] #130485
05/20/2017 09:32 AM
05/20/2017 09:32 AM
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,044
Colorado and Sailing the World
Maria_and_Steve Offline
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Club Orient is on the French Side, much different than the Dutch Side <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/jester.gif" alt="" />

Last edited by Maria_and_Steve; 05/20/2017 01:45 PM.
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: pat] #130486
05/20/2017 10:13 AM
05/20/2017 10:13 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,450
Long Island, NY
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Quote
pat said:
And then there's tradition.

We've been visiting the island annually since 1973 and while topless wasn't the norm on the Dutch beaches, Cupecoy was always the exception. There was NOTHING in this area and the beach access wasn't the easiest so almost anything was acceptable there from fully suited to buck naked and anything in between. It was a known tradition for that beach and everyone who might have something to say just looked the other way with regard to this one location. Basically, no harm, no foul. But you just knew, once the development of the area took place, people might agitate for changes in the tradition.

With regard to Sunset Beach Bar and 'drinking for free' - I've always wondered how that came about and whose palms were greased to allow it in the first place. <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/handshake.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/handshake.gif" alt="" />


I was always under the impression that the "Topless Ladies Drink for Free" was Neil Rooney's idea, but I may be mistaken.


Rick and Grace
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: RICKnGRACE_LI_NY] #130487
05/20/2017 11:13 AM
05/20/2017 11:13 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 11,650
Brookfield, CT.
pat Offline
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To the best of my knowledge, you're not mistaken at all but I'd still like to know the 'how' of him bringing it into being. One more case of well greased palms, I'm sure?

This particular spot was always a great location long before the existence of SSBB, and likewise, the other end of the beach where the Boat Bar is today. Neil came up with a great gimmick that made someone a lot of money, I'm sure, as did so many of his entrepreneurial activities. <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/handshake.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/handshake.gif" alt="" />


Respectfully,

pat



"Always keep your words soft and sweet, just in case you have to eat
them."
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: RICKnGRACE_LI_NY] #130488
05/20/2017 01:51 PM
05/20/2017 01:51 PM
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,143
Plaistow, New Hampshire
Paul_Marion Offline
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Plaistow, New Hampshire
You are correct !!!!!!!!!!!!


Remember the Monolith
Paul & Marion
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: RICKnGRACE_LI_NY] #130489
05/20/2017 02:34 PM
05/20/2017 02:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,143
Plaistow, New Hampshire
Paul_Marion Offline
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Some are still around.

Our favorite nude beaches pack in the mid 80's:

Cupecoy

Orient and a same section.

Dawn

Happy Bay

Tintamarri

Mullet (small section far from parking)

Ilet Pinel

Friars (once in while)

Gallion

La Belle Creole

Crand Case (the end)

Bay Rouge (1/3rd)

Terres Bas (on the rite)


That's all I can remember........

Some are still OK to go nude !!!!!!!!!!


Remember the Monolith
Paul & Marion
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: ruralcarrier] #130490
05/20/2017 04:25 PM
05/20/2017 04:25 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,083
Virginia
Snorkeller Offline
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I once ran down the local law with regard to nudity on the french-side. Maybe someone here could do that for the dutch-side, as opposed to mere speculation. As I understand it, Dutch law (as in the Netherlands) basically permits female topless bathing at any beach unless it is posted or otherwise made known that it is not permitted. Is simple female toplessness on Sint Maarten beaches or private property open to the public (like the bar at Sunset) illegal? Maybe someone can cite to a law that makes it illegal. Until I see such a law, I will believe that it is not illegal. Appropriate under specific circumstances? You can decide for yourself. Maybe I am wrong and I will give Neil a laugh, but I cannot imagine that Neil or anyone else paid any bribes to serve free drinks to topless women.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: Snorkeller] #130491
05/20/2017 04:29 PM
05/20/2017 04:29 PM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 254
Tennessee, USA
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Bobinmobile Offline
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Was at Karakter's today. Two females and several males topless. No issues.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: Bobinmobile] #130492
05/20/2017 08:34 PM
05/20/2017 08:34 PM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 6
KY
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StephKY Offline OP
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Thanks everyone for the info!!!

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: PelicanPirate] #130493
05/22/2017 05:20 PM
05/22/2017 05:20 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 128
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BobNLiz Offline
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We have stayed at PH's and really enjoyed it... Very modern, clean and I enjoyed the Central Air. Nive views. Only negative if I recall correctly is there is no elevator.. We were on the third floor and had to climb.. Not so bad really

Liz

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: StephKY] #130494
05/22/2017 07:45 PM
05/22/2017 07:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,463
Manhattan
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weeks5051 Online content
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I have seen at least one topless woman on every Beach I've gone to on both sides of the island. I haven't been to every beach but on Dawn I've seen a topless woman once in a while, usually away from the crowd though.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: weeks5051] #130495
05/22/2017 08:12 PM
05/22/2017 08:12 PM
Joined: Mar 2009
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Auburn, WA
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Tourist always push the envelope when they really should respect local laws and customs. That's all I got to say about this.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: SXMScubaman] #130496
05/23/2017 10:24 AM
05/23/2017 10:24 AM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,083
Virginia
Snorkeller Offline
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That's fine to say, but tourists have no reason to believe that simple female toplessness on beaches on the dutch-side is illegal. I do not believe it is illegal, but I could be wrong and am willing to stand corrected if someone can point me to a "law."

With specific regard to Dawn, at least pre-Luis (a way I can remember the time period) topless was very common on Dawn - there were very few cruisers going there many if not most of tourists were European. Has the written law (that's positive law for you pre-law folks) changed since then? I doubt it. Has the vibe and what is common changed - sure.

(On the french-side, the written law did change in January 2006 with regard to nudity - but not as to toplessness, which always has been acceptable on all beaches on the french-side as a matter of law - but even on french-side an establishment can post a "No Topless" rule for its property, probably including an area of concessionaire rights, and have the right to have it enforced.)

Sorry, but it bothers me to see people making statements about the law who just are expressing personal opinions and do not really know what the law is. If you do not believe a woman should sunbath topless on certain beaches on dutch-side, you certainly are entitled to your opinion - but, I do not think it has anything to do with respect or lack of respect for local laws.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: Snorkeller] #130497
05/23/2017 11:51 AM
05/23/2017 11:51 AM
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 834
Boston, MA
marge Offline
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Not so much ... "it has anything to do with respect or lack of respect for local laws".....as respect for local customs. The Dutch side is/was much more "conservative" than the French. I think of it as someone walking down the main street of their hometown in a bikini. Is it illegal? Probably not, but I'd bet it is not culturally accepted.
I have no law degree, but my personal opinion is that one must be respectful of the local culture. We are, after all, guests.


marge
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: marge] #130498
05/23/2017 12:00 PM
05/23/2017 12:00 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,821
Peaceful Eastern North Carolin...
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Quote
marge said:
... one must be respectful of the local culture. We are, after all, guests.


Exactly.


[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: GaKaye] #130499
05/23/2017 12:20 PM
05/23/2017 12:20 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,211
GJ, CO S/V Long Overdue
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What an active thread, why are Americans so obsessed with boobs.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: sail2wind] #130500
05/23/2017 12:22 PM
05/23/2017 12:22 PM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 221
Massachusetts USA
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Quote
sail2wind said:
What an active thread, why are Americans so obsessed with boobs.


Have you seen them? They are awesome!

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: marge] #130501
05/23/2017 01:06 PM
05/23/2017 01:06 PM
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Posts: 1,083
Virginia
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In terms of people born on each side, I do not think that the dutch-side is more conservative than the french-side with regard to what people wear or do not wear at the beach. Indeed, it is the french-side that has passed a specific local law making nudity illegal on french-side beaches, with the only specific exception being the Club Orient beach. I am unaware of any similar local law on the dutch-side, although maybe there is one about which I know nothing. Although toplessness is not considered "nudity" necessarily, they are related topics.

So, if a potential tourist is planning a trip to Sint Maarten and looks here for information about whether she can sunbath topless at Dawn beach, or any beach dutch-side, what is the local custom to which you refer? Is there a set local custom for Dawn or any other beach that you can provide in advance, or does it depend on who is on the beach doing what on any particular day?

(I limit my remarks both explicit and implicit to beaches - I am not referring to main streets or anywhere off of a beach. With regard to home towns, it kind of depends on where your home town is, would you not agree?)

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: tmsxmsails] #130502
05/23/2017 04:02 PM
05/23/2017 04:02 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,211
GJ, CO S/V Long Overdue
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Quote
tmsxmsails said:
Quote
sail2wind said:
What an active thread, why are Americans so obsessed with boobs.


Have you seen them? They are awesome!



some <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Grin.gif" alt="" />

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: sail2wind] #130503
05/23/2017 05:18 PM
05/23/2017 05:18 PM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 7,738
Auburn, WA
SXMScubaman Online content
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Time to close this one.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: Snorkeller] #130504
05/24/2017 10:54 AM
05/24/2017 10:54 AM
Joined: May 2004
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Virginia
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The OP asked "Is Dawn beach topless?" Why is that not a fair and simple question? My answer is a simple "Yes" - Dawn is a topless beach and you should feel free to go topless there on the beach.

Other posts in this thread seem to say that maybe the answer is "No" because of "local custom" or "local culture." And, the need to "respect" "local custom" or "local culture."

Can those who post about "local custom" or "local culture" give a simple answer as to whether they believe Dawn beach, specifically Dawn beach, is topless or not?

If not a simple answer, is there a more complicated answer dependent on certain observable conditions - again, as to Dawn beach, specifically.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: Snorkeller] #130505
05/24/2017 03:55 PM
05/24/2017 03:55 PM
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Posts: 13,004
Ohio
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My simple answer based on 25+ years of travel to the island and 40+ trips and knowing many local residents would be, "NO".

Now, if people want to disrespect local customs and strip down and run around naked and/or topless all over the island, I guess they can have at it and see what happens.


J.D.
Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: ruralcarrier] #130506
05/24/2017 05:10 PM
05/24/2017 05:10 PM
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Virginia
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Is it possible for you to offer an opinion limited to whether Dawn beach is a topless beach or not?

No one has suggested or is suggesting that it is legal or acceptable to "strip down and run naked and/or topless all over the island."

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: Snorkeller] #130507
05/24/2017 05:57 PM
05/24/2017 05:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2009
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Auburn, WA
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Posts: 7,738
Auburn, WA
It has been mentioned that it is not legal on the Dutch side but some people, mostly tourists, will do it anyway by ignoring the law. And that includes Dawn Beach.

Re: Topless on Dawn beach?? [Re: Snorkeller] #130508
05/24/2017 06:30 PM
05/24/2017 06:30 PM
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,004
Ohio
ruralcarrier Offline
Traveler
ruralcarrier  Offline
Traveler
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,004
Ohio
Quote
Snorkeller said:
Is it possible for you to offer an opinion limited to whether Dawn beach is a topless beach or not?

No one has suggested or is suggesting that it is legal or acceptable to "strip down and run naked and/or topless all over the island."


Did you miss this part?

My simple answer based on 25+ years of travel to the island and 40+ trips and knowing many local residents would be, "NO".


J.D.
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