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Am I being unreasonable? #220587
03/13/2020 09:23 PM
03/13/2020 09:23 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 165
Ottawa, Canada
TimS Offline OP
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TimS  Offline OP
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Ottawa, Canada
Yesterday we had to cancel our BVI charter. The Canadian government is discouraging all unnecessary international travel and strongly suggesting that if we do travel, we should self isolate for two weeks when we return. Additionally, the BVI has introduced new screening and the possibility of being put into isolation upon arrival, and we are in a high risk demographic.
When we cancelled, Air Canada was very helpful and has extended our tickets for a year. Similarly Inter Caribbean has extended for a year. Riteway cancelled our provisioning immediately, and Montreal Airport even refunded our pre paid parking for a week. The only people who were unwilling to offer any assistance was the Charter Company, a company that We have used exclusively for 15 years for Caribbean charters.
I know that all the companies recommend cancellation insurance but these seem to be contingent on someone being sick, or, the destination being on the government travel advisory list so could be a challenge to collect.
Given the current situation I wonder if it is unreasonable to think that the charter companies and yacht owners might share in the cost. Not a refund, but perhaps some sort of discount for a future charter. Am I being unreasonable?

Tim

BVI Sponsors
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220590
03/13/2020 09:45 PM
03/13/2020 09:45 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,124
Memphis, BVI, CT
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RatmansWife Offline
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Your charter company recommended travel insurance and you chose not to buy it. That puts you in a weak position. It's possible it wouldn't have covered, unless you got sick or the government prevents you from traveling.

Your best course of action is to be as nice and reasonable as possible. Remind them you are a loyal customer and would like to work with them. It's unlikely they will find anyone to fill your slot, and they may still owe the yacht owner money, depending on their contract. Maybe ask if they would give you a credit toward low season charter.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220594
03/13/2020 10:05 PM
03/13/2020 10:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 457
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706jim Offline
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Many insurance companies don't cover for anything but medical emergencies. So, is this pandemic medical or is it not?
My point being that travel cancellation insurance may have loopholes so that they don't have to pay in this situation.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220596
03/13/2020 10:25 PM
03/13/2020 10:25 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,147
road town
sleepychef Offline
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If they won't refund/credit then why bother cancelling?

If your charter is in a week or 2 things may of changed in the BVI so you cannot enter and so they will have to refund or credit.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: sleepychef] #220597
03/13/2020 10:34 PM
03/13/2020 10:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 727
Georgia & South Carolina
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Deepcut Offline
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Originally Posted by sleepychef
If they won't refund/credit then why bother cancelling?

If your charter is in a week or 2 things may of changed in the BVI so you cannot enter and so they will have to refund or credit.


So Sleepchef, who are "they" ? Charter company?

I don't think charter owner/company is responsible for assuring your ability to enter the BVI , or your flight being on time.

They ARE responsible for providing the boat outlined in the charter agreement.

Travel insurance policies vary on coverage (loopholes) and should be read carefully.

ANY concessions or exceptions to cancellation policy outlined in the charter contract should be appreciated as a gift.


Wes
s/v Sea Tiger (2021 Lagoon 46)
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: Deepcut] #220605
03/13/2020 11:32 PM
03/13/2020 11:32 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,563
Woodstock, GA
RickinAtlanta Offline
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These same charter companies BEGGED for business after Irma!! They should be accommodating to this extreme situation and at least offer to allow a reschedule of the charter. It's not like they have a line of customers waiting to charter that same Cat! People remember the way they treat you and move your money elsewhere!

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220606
03/14/2020 12:12 AM
03/14/2020 12:12 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,131
Ontario, Canada
warren460 Offline
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It’s a very tough question, many charter boat owners that I know are still suffering from low bookkings post Irma. Many boat owners still have debt that needs to be serviced.

Why should the owner suffer more losses? Why should the traveler? Or the bvi restaurant?

Does the moorings insurance policy cover them in the event they voluntarily give refunds?

I don’t know how the airlines can afford to offer the concessions?

I have no idea what is fair or reasonable. It’s a tough situation for everyone.


Warren S/V Scuba Doo
Lagoon 50 (winner of best crewed yacht under 55 feet at the St. Thomas crewed yacht boat show).

https://www.cyabrochure.com/ebn/2307/pdyrX/6642/4///
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: Deepcut] #220626
03/14/2020 08:01 AM
03/14/2020 08:01 AM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,147
road town
sleepychef Offline
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sleepychef  Offline
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I have no idea who"they" are, But must be a company not an individual.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220633
03/14/2020 08:50 AM
03/14/2020 08:50 AM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,001
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sail445 Offline
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Originally Posted by TimS
Yesterday we had to cancel our BVI charter. The Canadian government is discouraging all unnecessary international travel and strongly suggesting that if we do travel, we should self isolate for two weeks when we return. Additionally, the BVI has introduced new screening and the possibility of being put into isolation upon arrival, and we are in a high risk demographic.
When we cancelled, Air Canada was very helpful and has extended our tickets for a year. Similarly Inter Caribbean has extended for a year. Riteway cancelled our provisioning immediately, and Montreal Airport even refunded our pre paid parking for a week. The only people who were unwilling to offer any assistance was the Charter Company, a company that We have used exclusively for 15 years for Caribbean charters.
I know that all the companies recommend cancellation insurance but these seem to be contingent on someone being sick, or, the destination being on the government travel advisory list so could be a challenge to collect.
Given the current situation I wonder if it is unreasonable to think that the charter companies and yacht owners might share in the cost. Not a refund, but perhaps some sort of discount for a future charter. Am I being unreasonable?

Tim


Horizon isn’t at all reputable. They’re deceptive in sales and in their communication with the client.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220672
03/14/2020 11:15 AM
03/14/2020 11:15 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 869
Louisville, KY
NoelHall Offline
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I'm sure you are not alone in this situation, many are caught and scrambling to make travel decisions. You didn't state the dates of your charter, however since you had already paid for parking at the airport, I assume travel was imminent. I would also assume your charter is paid in full. Unfortunately, it is obvious folks are exposed to financial loss if you cancel. If I understand correctly, "the Canadian government is discouraging all unnecessary international travel", not prohibiting travel. In this case it is a personal decision to cancel, in hopes everyone involved will be sympathetic to your decision. We all expect charter companies to honor the terms of a contract, and it goes both ways. In other words, it is not the fault of the charter company you have decided to cancel your charter. As a result, you are asking the charter company to make a 'customer relations' decision, not a contractual decision. You ask "am I being unreasonable"? My opinion is … no you are not. Neither you, nor the charter company created this situation, and as a previous response suggested, do your best to resolve the issue with the charter company in a civil manner. If it is not settled fairly in your opinion, then moving your future business to another charter company would be understandable.


Noel Hall
"It is humbling indeed, to discover my own opinion is only correct less than 50% of the time."

www.noelhall.com
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220680
03/14/2020 12:36 PM
03/14/2020 12:36 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 29
Frankfort, Michigan
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hotdogman Offline
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We’re on the fence about a charter and land based stay scheduled in 2 weeks. I reached out to the (st. thomas based) charter company about rescheduling and it was absolutely no problem at all. They said charterers are extending their trips and they have had a lot of short notice bookings in lieu of reduced airfare. Contractually, they had no obligation to honor my request as we elected not to purchase the insurance that they offered. I expected nothing less than complete understanding from them as we’ve had nothing but positive, fair dealings with them for 8 previous charters. This is one of the many reasons we have and will continue to do business with them.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220706
03/14/2020 03:08 PM
03/14/2020 03:08 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,037
Charlotte, NC
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NCSailor Offline
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I would be surprised if the unknown charter company would not allow you a credit and a period of time to rebook. They keep your money. You rebook in the fall. If the the charter company was unwilling to extend this courtesy then I would not do business with them again. I have had different but similar issues with the Moorings and they worked with me.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: RickinAtlanta] #220707
03/14/2020 03:16 PM
03/14/2020 03:16 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 547
Apex, NC
agrimsrud Offline
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Originally Posted by RickinAtlanta
They should be accommodating to this extreme situation and at least offer to allow a reschedule of the charter. It's not like they have a line of customers waiting to charter that same Cat! People remember the way they treat you and move your money elsewhere!


The charter company could have chartered the boat to someone else who didn't have the same travel issue/restriction. So it's not like the charter company doesn't have something to lose. Best to have a nice conversation with the charter company to see if your dates can be deferred to a different date. Legally I think you have no standing. Insurance was available and there is always some sort of insurance that will cover you for just about anything given a premium to match. Obviously it's in the interest of the charter company to be on good terms with all possible customers. So I suspect you can wiggle something that is better than forfeiting your charter fees. Good luck!


Life's short - sail more!
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220745
03/14/2020 05:57 PM
03/14/2020 05:57 PM
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Posts: 727
Georgia & South Carolina
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Deepcut Offline
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Charter company, if in "performance" program, loses nothing. However the boat owner cannot charter the week that the "cancelled" charterer moves to. Per the contract. the charterer has no case.... but we want to do what we can to be fair.

I am working on a response to allow moving to weeks that are available approximately 2 months out from departure date(ie relatively "short notice"). With a little flexibility, I should be able to accommodate any reschedules without greatly affecting revenue.


Wes
s/v Sea Tiger (2021 Lagoon 46)
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220885
03/15/2020 10:56 AM
03/15/2020 10:56 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 97
South Central Texas
hocndoc Offline
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FYI: Our trip insurance through Delta's Alluanz informed us that since the WHO designated the virus as an epidemic. We aren't covered for any our cancellations on a couple of trips this season.


I've got a mustard seed and I'm not afraid to use it.
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: hocndoc] #220951
03/15/2020 02:19 PM
03/15/2020 02:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 727
Georgia & South Carolina
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Deepcut Offline
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Originally Posted by hocndoc
FYI: Our trip insurance through Delta's Alluanz informed us that since the WHO designated the virus as an epidemic. We aren't covered for any our cancellations on a couple of trips this season.


So who does this transfer the burden to? If not the insurer (due to their contract with you), who is responsible for your lost travel?


Wes
s/v Sea Tiger (2021 Lagoon 46)
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220974
03/15/2020 04:16 PM
03/15/2020 04:16 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 165
Ottawa, Canada
TimS Offline OP
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TimS  Offline OP
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Ottawa, Canada
Thanks for all the replies
I can’t help feeling that in the good times we all share in the winnings. We get a vacation and the yacht owner and charter company get paid. These, however, are not the good times and it would be nice if we all shared in the pain. I don’t expect that will happen, but it would be nice.

Tim

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220982
03/15/2020 04:56 PM
03/15/2020 04:56 PM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 989
Washington DC
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bailau Offline
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I think the charter company accommodating people for situations like this goes a long way. I have done this with my beach house various times for guests with issues or situation changes...

I use Moorings for this very reason and I know there are other charter companies out there that do well by doing it right. In this case they said give them as much advance notice as possible but it has to be greater than 15 days for a credit to rebook by the Fall.

Unless there is more to the story (e.g. your charter is a couple of days out) this really surprises me

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220991
03/15/2020 05:33 PM
03/15/2020 05:33 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 165
Ottawa, Canada
TimS Offline OP
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TimS  Offline OP
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Ottawa, Canada
Hi Bailau
In fairness our charter was only 3 days out when we had to cancel. I don’t expect the charter company will do anything. I guess the result will be that I will not rule out using the company in the future but they will have to compete for my business - something that I have not done in the past. After all, if 15 years of loyalty is worth nothing to them then it is not worth much to me.

Tim

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #220995
03/15/2020 05:51 PM
03/15/2020 05:51 PM
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Posts: 989
Washington DC
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bailau Offline
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Tim-

If they wont at least give you a nice discount next time after 15 years then I would go elsewhere for sure...sorry to hear my friend

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #221023
03/15/2020 09:39 PM
03/15/2020 09:39 PM
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sail445 Offline
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Originally Posted by TimS
Thanks for all the replies
I can’t help feeling that in the good times we all share in the winnings. We get a vacation and the yacht owner and charter company get paid. These, however, are not the good times and it would be nice if we all shared in the pain. I don’t expect that will happen, but it would be nice.

Tim


Tom, the situation with Corona virus is something that wasn’t predictable yet everyone and every business knows about the restrictions being imposed on a daily basis.
You chartered with Horizon who hasn’t been living in a cave without outside contact in good faith like you have for the previous 15 charters and they should refund or credit you to let you choose another date.
Loyalty to a business is not what it used to be 20 years ago.
I would give them the single finger salute and move on.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: sail445] #221031
03/15/2020 10:54 PM
03/15/2020 10:54 PM
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Posts: 727
Georgia & South Carolina
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Deepcut Offline
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Originally Posted by sail445
Originally Posted by TimS
Thanks for all the replies
I
nice if we all shared in the pain. I don’t expect that will happen, but it would be nice.

Tim


Tom, the situation with Corona virus is something that wasn’t predictable yet everyone and every business knows about the restrictions
.


While neither you, nor the charter company, nor the boat owner was responsible causing this pandemic. None anticipated it.

Were you not give opportunity to purchase "travel insurance" which likely would cover your trip cancellation? (And we highly recommend Travel Insurance on each quote.

The Charter BOAT owner, who counts on revenue to cover ongoing costs and rarely shows a profit, if given a refund (which per the charter contract is not refundable, and all parties agreed to prior to Covid 19), would be bearing essentially all the "pain" as the charter company would still have their commission, and turnover fees. And the charterer would have received their cash back.

Allowing carte blanche substitution for future date could prevent other charters to book, thus reducing revenue.

So I would suggest that the charterer should have purchased travel insurance.

I am working with my charterers by striving to offer several specific weeks at a later date, which should work out for all if all are somewhat flexible. Allowing Covid19 charterers to recapture their vacation which (at this time) is potentially being canceled due to a "fear of travel". Also allowing charter boat operator to satisfy the pro forma to make charter boat ownership reasonable. (Remember that many of the charter boat owners were hit hard in pocketbook by Irma as they had that financial pain(ie $$) all to themselves(ie all deposits were refunded and no revenue, combined with very unexpected expenses, made for tremendous losses). So I am doing this not because of a duty (based on the contract), but based on my desire to do more than my obligation, and I would appreciate the same if the table was turned.


Wes
s/v Sea Tiger (2021 Lagoon 46)
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #221036
03/16/2020 12:29 AM
03/16/2020 12:29 AM
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Posts: 296
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Kryssa Offline
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Travel insurance generally does not cover cancelling due to fear of illness (pandemic or otherwise.) It would only pay out if a doctor verified that you are personally too ill to travel.

The exception to this is to buy "cancel for any reason" insurance by the prices are outrageous because they need to plan for people who will decide not to travel for no particular reason at all.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: Deepcut] #221037
03/16/2020 12:33 AM
03/16/2020 12:33 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 97
South Central Texas
hocndoc Offline
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South Central Texas
Me.


I've got a mustard seed and I'm not afraid to use it.
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: Kryssa] #221056
03/16/2020 07:46 AM
03/16/2020 07:46 AM
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Posts: 727
Georgia & South Carolina
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Deepcut Offline
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Originally Posted by Kryssa
Travel insurance generally does not cover cancelling due to fear of illness (pandemic or otherwise.) It would only pay out if a doctor verified that you are personally too ill to travel.

The exception to this is to buy "cancel for any reason" insurance by the prices are outrageous because they need to plan for people who will decide not to travel for no particular reason at all.


Agree.

Insurance will not cover if you change your mind about wanting to go on a cruise or any other vacation.


Wes
s/v Sea Tiger (2021 Lagoon 46)
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #221190
03/16/2020 12:07 PM
03/16/2020 12:07 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 165
Ottawa, Canada
TimS Offline OP
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TimS  Offline OP
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Ottawa, Canada
Update. I have just received an extremely generous postponement offer from the Charter company. My faith in them is now fully restored and I look forward to the next 15 years of chartering through them!

Tim

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #221191
03/16/2020 12:10 PM
03/16/2020 12:10 PM
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 42
Charlotte, NC
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TC42 Offline
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Good Outcome. We have a trip planned to another island departing on 4/8. The charter company is allowing us to reschedule without a fee to anytime this year. If the charter is more $ then we pay the difference. If it is less money...too bad. Still a good outcome.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #221202
03/16/2020 12:25 PM
03/16/2020 12:25 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 869
Louisville, KY
NoelHall Offline
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Great news, these are crazy times. I suspect your 'civil' approach has given you the result you for hoping for.


Noel Hall
"It is humbling indeed, to discover my own opinion is only correct less than 50% of the time."

www.noelhall.com
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: Deepcut] #221203
03/16/2020 12:29 PM
03/16/2020 12:29 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,563
Woodstock, GA
RickinAtlanta Offline
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Originally Posted by Deepcut
Originally Posted by Kryssa
Travel insurance generally does not cover cancelling due to fear of illness (pandemic or otherwise.) It would only pay out if a doctor verified that you are personally too ill to travel.

The exception to this is to buy "cancel for any reason" insurance by the prices are outrageous because they need to plan for people who will decide not to travel for no particular reason at all.


Agree.

Insurance will not cover if you change your mind about wanting to go on a cruise or any other vacation.


Cancel for any reason WILL.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #221208
03/16/2020 12:42 PM
03/16/2020 12:42 PM
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Washington DC
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bailau Offline
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Originally Posted by TimS
Update. I have just received an extremely generous postponement offer from the Charter company. My faith in them is now fully restored and I look forward to the next 15 years of chartering through them!

Tim

Great news Tim...I am hoping we get out in May but they know if we dont/cant we will be out as soon as we can to support our friends in the BVI and have a great time with friends....

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: bailau] #221225
03/16/2020 01:10 PM
03/16/2020 01:10 PM
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Fun in the sun Offline
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I am glad to hear your charter company worked with you on a reasonable settlement.

I am a little surprised the charter companies in the BVI have not offered to deliver the boats to the USVI.

If the charter did not cross over to the BVI, there would not be a problem. Of course this option would prohibit one from crossing into the BVI but it would be better than nothing.

We have been on 16 bare boat charters to the BVI and are scheduled to go again in late May and early June.

Holding our breath that we get to make the trip.

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: Fun in the sun] #221231
03/16/2020 01:23 PM
03/16/2020 01:23 PM
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Refunds are generally off the table for the simple reason that they dont have the money to do so. A credit is obviously the smartest move for the company if they ever want re-peat bookings, which I suspect 81% of the TTOL charterers are! I just spoke with another large company that as of this moment is offering nothing on my April Antigua trip but she said the pressure is mounting everyday and expects a full rebook credit will be company policy within the week

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: NoelHall] #222763
03/25/2020 09:31 AM
03/25/2020 09:31 AM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 17
Clifton, VA
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Clifton, VA


For some reason, I can't quote a previous post, but this is in response to the statement(s) about trip insurance. Basic trip insurance is quite restrictive, and my Wife and I do not purchase it. We do sometimes purchase "Cancel for any reason" insurance. Yes, it is more expensive, but not prohibitively so. We planned a very expensive trip to Tanzania about six months ago, and I have some minor health issues that may be a problem if anything changes in Tanzania, disease-wise, so we bought a good insurance plan. We can literally cancel for ANY reason, even if we just decide, "nope, we don't want to go anymore". The poilcy cost less than 10% of the overall cost of the trip, which seems very reasonable given the coverage. IMHO, if a trip is expensive enough that it would be a hardship if you lost the cost, then good trip insurance is worth the expense.

Regarding charter companies refunding fees, I would be surprised if they could do that financially. I'm by far no expert, but I would think that in most cases, when you use a charter company you are not renting the boat from the boat owner, the charter company is, and you are paying the charter company. So, the charter company still owes something to the owner, even if you cancel. We have sailed the BVI 9 times in the past 15 years. The first time, we chartered through TMM, one of their boats and a skipper they provided. Every trip since has been chartered directly through the owner of the boat, three different boats over this time period. We thankfully have not had to cancel any trips, but truly feel that if we had to cancel, we would get some sort of noticeable refund, or a credit towards future travel, and this would be done quite easily. The fewer fingers in the pie, the better. Just my $0.02 worth.


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Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: desmofan] #222778
03/25/2020 11:12 AM
03/25/2020 11:12 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 118
Folsom Lake, CA
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Latadjust Offline
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Latadjust  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 118
Folsom Lake, CA
Originally Posted by desmofan


, so we bought a good insurance plan. We can literally cancel for ANY reason, even if we just decide, "nope, we don't want to go anymore". The poilcy cost less than 10% of the overall cost of the trip, which seems very reasonable given the coverage.


That's a great rate for Cancel for any reason insurance! Care to share who that was with?

Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #222790
03/25/2020 11:55 AM
03/25/2020 11:55 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 805
Middleburg, VA
cwoody Offline
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Posts: 805
Middleburg, VA
Just a FYI. Word Nomads is the travel insurance that Horizon recommends.

I did not purchase for my upcoming trip.

Here is World Nomads policy:

I had booked travel to a country that has now closed its borders. Am I covered?

Many countries have been refusing entry to tourists as a way to prevent the spread of COVID-19. While we understand this has impacted many people’s upcoming trips, unfortunately,
our travel insurance does not cover border closings or travel bans when it comes to trip cancellation.
However, if the border is closed, please contact your travel provider for assistance; they may be able to offer you alternate dates or waive change fees.


Looks like it would not have been much help for the current situation in the BVI.

Here's hoping for open borders by June!


Chuck W.
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Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #222798
03/25/2020 12:16 PM
03/25/2020 12:16 PM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 989
Washington DC
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bailau Offline
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Washington DC
That really sucks...I told my guests for my beachhouse if you CANT get there for whatever reason you are getting all your money back, 50% of which has already been disbursed to me. I dont know who took insurance or not or if it even covers it after reading these posts

I indicated if you COULD GET there but DONT want to go then we have to have a different conversation.

I dont mind credits for myself as long as I am reasonably sure about the long term business prospects of the debtor.....I am sure there will lots of bankruptcies coming out of this unfortunately. Unlike a hurricane, I wold be curious to what business interruption insurance covers for Moorings by example...




Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #222804
03/25/2020 01:20 PM
03/25/2020 01:20 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,849
Bradenton, FL
Winterstale Offline
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Winterstale  Offline
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Bradenton, FL
“Here's hoping for open borders by June!”

I am hoping by May 24 frown


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Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: Winterstale] #222815
03/25/2020 01:58 PM
03/25/2020 01:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 805
Middleburg, VA
cwoody Offline
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cwoody  Offline
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Posts: 805
Middleburg, VA
Originally Posted by Winterstale
“Here's hoping for open borders by June!”

I am hoping by May 24 frown


Let's just make it May 1..... We Should we start a TTOL pool...


Chuck W.
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BVI Pics
Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #222819
03/25/2020 02:38 PM
03/25/2020 02:38 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 552
Kannapolis, NC
ndfaninnc Offline
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ndfaninnc  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 552
Kannapolis, NC
I haven't given up on May 9th yet. I've got every finger crossed.


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Re: Am I being unreasonable? [Re: TimS] #222831
03/25/2020 04:20 PM
03/25/2020 04:20 PM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 989
Washington DC
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bailau Offline
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Hoping May 11...the college kids are like caged animals...

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