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Atrium fires virtually all employees #224828
04/16/2020 09:02 AM
04/16/2020 09:02 AM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 75,736
Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline OP
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Carol_Hill  Offline OP
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Daily Herald story

With what little I know of SXM labor laws, I don't really think they can do this.


Carol Hill
SXM Sponsors
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224830
04/16/2020 09:07 AM
04/16/2020 09:07 AM
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 16,249
Ohio
ruralcarrier Offline
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I wondered about that when I read it.


J.D.
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: ruralcarrier] #224831
04/16/2020 09:09 AM
04/16/2020 09:09 AM
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Posts: 75,736
Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline OP
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I believe that the courthouse in SXM is shut down currently, but I guarantee when the union can sue over this, they will.


Carol Hill
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224832
04/16/2020 09:38 AM
04/16/2020 09:38 AM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,336
Massachusetts
boucharda Online content
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boucharda  Online Content
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So "fired" sounds a bit permanent....does this mean that the resort will not reopen or is it a way to start over with new employees once the Island is up and running?

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: boucharda] #224833
04/16/2020 09:44 AM
04/16/2020 09:44 AM
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Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline OP
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It's a way to get rid of all employees and start over, once they are able to reopen. Don't have to pay them in the meantime, and no seniority, etc., even if they re-hire the same people.


Carol Hill
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224834
04/16/2020 09:50 AM
04/16/2020 09:50 AM
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Posts: 4,399
Kennys Offline
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Hi Carol , they will loose this case in Court . They are trying to 'dodge the bullet". Royal Palm paid all their employees properly and will start from fresh when they reopen.

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Kennys] #224835
04/16/2020 09:56 AM
04/16/2020 09:56 AM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 75,736
Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline OP
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That's what I thought, Lesley. Not sure why they would even bother. I guess maybe they are thinking some people will just take the money? They have to know they will lose.


Carol Hill
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224836
04/16/2020 10:02 AM
04/16/2020 10:02 AM
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Kennys Offline
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Well , I saw the news paper mentioned $ 3,000.00 average depending on the amount of years ( 20 years ) that's nothing . And a lot of people are broke but they can't allow themselves to trapped by accepting that small compensation.

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224837
04/16/2020 10:11 AM
04/16/2020 10:11 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,422
Brookfield, CT.
pat Offline
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I hope the employees are able to stand firm in their resolve but unfortunately, when you have a family to take care of and no substantial monies to do it with, $3000.00 sounds like a lot. I’ve always understood the SXM labor laws to be pretty tough when it came to discharging an employee even with grounds, so it will be interesting to see what happens here.

Stand strong, SXM people, as you always do.


Respectfully,

pat



"Always keep your words soft and sweet, just in case you have to eat
them."
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224841
04/16/2020 10:40 AM
04/16/2020 10:40 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,339
a little right of center
2
2fingers Offline
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a little right of center
If Atrium is closed with no revenue coming in, where does the money to pay them come from? And if there is no money to pay the employees, what are they supposed to do?


"It's 5 o'clock somewhere!"

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Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224844
04/16/2020 10:47 AM
04/16/2020 10:47 AM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 14,308
Auburn, WA
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Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: 2fingers] #224848
04/16/2020 11:09 AM
04/16/2020 11:09 AM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 75,736
Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline OP
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Basically same situation as after hurricanes in the past, SXM labor laws do NOT allow termination in this circumstance. Not saying they are correct, from a business point of view, but that's the way it's always been in SXM.


Carol Hill
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224854
04/16/2020 11:52 AM
04/16/2020 11:52 AM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,336
Massachusetts
boucharda Online content
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What about furlough? No wages but not fired and ability to keep seniority and an eventual return to work....and no court battles and confusion on reopening (if they reopen)

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224855
04/16/2020 11:53 AM
04/16/2020 11:53 AM
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 43
Philadelphia.PA
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Seaisle Offline
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Those type of laws drive many companies into bankruptcy, the result a permanent loss of jobs

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Seaisle] #224856
04/16/2020 12:07 PM
04/16/2020 12:07 PM
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they might do as Caravanseri did. Reopen as another company in a auction purchase.

Wendell

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224860
04/16/2020 01:15 PM
04/16/2020 01:15 PM
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SammyM Offline
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This is just awful. Of course, they will have to pay these workers unemployment benefits which would apply on St. Maarten as part of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. That means 75% of their working wage for two months, and another 70% of their wages beyond that capped at 38 months. However, employees must be smart here and not sign anything that would preclude them from such benefits if they accept the $3,000 severance pay. Maybe Carol can chime in here, but these former employees should be careful before signing anything that could jeopardize collecting UM benefits for the next 9-1/2 months. This can get tricky. The $3,000 could also be set against the unemployment benefits they would be collecting. Probably a lot more to come on this.

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: SammyM] #224861
04/16/2020 01:23 PM
04/16/2020 01:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 75,736
Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline OP
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As Pat said, I think some people may take the $3,000 and run, perhaps to go to a different island, although it's tough to travel anywhere these days. I am not that familiar with SXM labor laws, but if they do take the $3,000, probably they would waive any other rights they have.


Carol Hill
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224867
04/16/2020 01:53 PM
04/16/2020 01:53 PM
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Kennys Offline
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But the $ 3,000.00 is not for too many workers only those with twenty years of service.

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224868
04/16/2020 02:07 PM
04/16/2020 02:07 PM
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SammyM Offline
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Where I Iive in NW Pennsylvania we recently had a man who was highly respected abruptly discontinue medical benefits for all of his hotel, restaurant and amusement (water park) staff. Likely some type of board decision here, but I can't wrap my head around doing this (especially given his presumed wealth). Maybe financially this couldn't have been averted, but when COVID-19 finally ends and it's safe to "go into the water" again, his restaurants will not be at the top of my dining choices locally. By no means am I advocating boycotting placed like The Atrium in the future, but I would like to read stories about the establishments on St. Maarten that are taking care of their staff as part of the family. I will most definitely remember those places when we return to SXM.

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Kennys] #224870
04/16/2020 02:11 PM
04/16/2020 02:11 PM
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Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline OP
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Lesley--Ok, thanks for the clarification.


Carol Hill
Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: SammyM] #224920
04/16/2020 09:34 PM
04/16/2020 09:34 PM
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Nick Scott????

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224923
04/16/2020 11:49 PM
04/16/2020 11:49 PM
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SammyM Offline
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It wasn't my intention to name any names, but since you did ... Where I worked for 37 wonderful years I remember my exit interview with the CEO and the one thing he said to me that I'll always remember was "Our company's greatest asset isn't our shareholders or the beautiful buildings on our campus, but our greatest assets are 1,700 employees like you that walk through those doors every morning and depart later that day." (Though if I was still employed there today I'd be working from home for a while).

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #224926
04/17/2020 05:09 AM
04/17/2020 05:09 AM
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PelicanPirate Offline
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6 months of airport shutdown and business shutdown will make a Hurricane look like nothing.

Labor laws worldwide will be tested like never seen before.

When was the last Pandemic closing all businesses worldwide?

If SXM businesses are running the numbers/thinking they are going to be shutdown at least 2 and maybe 6 months to go along with the airport hibernation periods.................. you can expect many businesses to be thinking in the EXTREME as in bankruptcy and gone for good or bankruptcy and popping up as a whole new entity shedding all costs/obligations from the past.

IMHO, any city/state/country not making an effort in May to begin opening up with all the precautions GALORE (tests, twmperature taking all day, social distancing, masks (yes masks on the beach and pool deck) , bandanas, gloves, sanitizer stations, distanced lounge chairs, room service, restaurant delivery service, distanced restaurant tables, and on and on............may as well get into a Delorean Time machine back to 1932. We will be shoved beyond major recession into a depression with 30% GDP contraction where everything we hold onto will be at stake. Everything!

Think of this, when we hit 15,000 dead in the US, we also hit 15,000,000 unemployed. That is 1000 jobs lost/death.

What is the job loss/death metric on SXM?

People die everyday, what is the acceptable COVID death rate per day/year?

Do we return to work/play and what is the acceptable casualty rate? It wont be zero even with a vaccine.

Their is a risk in everything we do.........What is COVID risk tolerance............varies by age

Over 50, good year to staycation. Under 40, roll the dice. 40-50 have corona covering travel insurance if you can buy it.

I suspect most of TTOL over 50. Sorry kids. The rest of the world, get back to work and play and dont forget your mask and sanitizer.

So maybe Atrium has fast forwarded 6 months and sees an empty isalnd and maybe $3000 will be alot of money.

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: SammyM] #224937
04/17/2020 08:22 AM
04/17/2020 08:22 AM
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blackmercedes Offline
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Originally Posted by SammyM
It wasn't my intention to name any names, but since you did ... Where I worked for 37 wonderful years I remember my exit interview with the CEO and the one thing he said to me that I'll always remember was "Our company's greatest asset isn't our shareholders or the beautiful buildings on our campus, but our greatest assets are 1,700 employees like you that walk through those doors every morning and depart later that day." (Though if I was still employed there today I'd be working from home for a while).

I'm sorry. I should not have put his name I guess. I was just floored to read your comment. I didn't hear a thing about this on the news here. Very Sad. We live in Waterford.

Re: Atrium fires virtually all employees [Re: Carol_Hill] #225014
04/17/2020 11:28 PM
04/17/2020 11:28 PM
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SammyM Offline
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So, we're essentially neighbors Blackmercedes! Look forward to meeting you someday when we return to St. Martin, possibly in 2021. I had the pleasure to meet 'J.D.' in early March and it's really nice to share our stories about our past experiences on SXM. I don't want to judge the Atrium for their actions, but this place will most likely reopen again (possibly this fall) and to me it sounds as if things will be much more difficult if you have to train all new personnel. I just hate to see people losing their jobs both here and on St. Martin during this pandemic, but maybe some of these actions are inevitable. And, to your point, when the local restaurants re-open in this part of Pennsylvania my wife and I will be much more likely dining at 'Sugar n' Spice' than shall we say 'Quaker Steak & Lube'.


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