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Back online now #109891
10/18/2016 10:17 AM
10/18/2016 10:17 AM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,573
Eric_Hill Offline OP

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Eric_Hill  Offline OP

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There is a reward for the backhoe operator that dug up the major internet line.

In the last half hour the error and alarms lights finally cleared from the internet access card. Actually there is a truck roll that was on the way to possibly replace their access module because of all the errors.

Actually verizon is onsite right now, going to run a bunch of tests.


Eric Hill
TTOL Sponsors
BVI Sponsors
Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109892
10/18/2016 10:26 AM
10/18/2016 10:26 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,565
Woodstock, GA
RickinAtlanta Offline
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RickinAtlanta  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,565
Woodstock, GA
Thank God as all this time I thought my desktop had somehow blocked this!

Re: Back online now [Re: RickinAtlanta] #109893
10/18/2016 10:42 AM
10/18/2016 10:42 AM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,573
Eric_Hill Offline OP

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Eric_Hill  Offline OP

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Posts: 11,573
I have a whole lot less hair than I did at 4:15 last Friday! Was online at the time the internet line was cut. Then errors lights all over the place. Servers just could not send out anything.


Eric Hill
TTOL Sponsors
Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109894
10/18/2016 10:51 AM
10/18/2016 10:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 282
California
Sunnykm Offline
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Sunnykm  Offline
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Posts: 282
California
I was getting a little shaky and jittery wondering why ttol was offline!

Re: Back online now [Re: Sunnykm] #109895
10/18/2016 11:45 AM
10/18/2016 11:45 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,131
Ontario, Canada
warren460 Offline
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warren460  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,131
Ontario, Canada
Welcome back


Warren S/V Scuba Doo
Lagoon 50 (winner of best crewed yacht under 55 feet at the St. Thomas crewed yacht boat show).

https://www.cyabrochure.com/ebn/2307/pdyrX/6642/4///
Re: Back online now [Re: warren460] #109896
10/18/2016 11:56 AM
10/18/2016 11:56 AM
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 296
K
Kryssa Offline
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Kryssa  Offline
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K
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 296
So happy to see everyone again!!!

Last edited by Kryssa; 10/18/2016 11:56 AM.
Re: Back online now [Re: Kryssa] #109897
10/18/2016 11:57 AM
10/18/2016 11:57 AM
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 36
PNW
J
JustBS Offline
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JustBS  Offline
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J
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 36
PNW
Yay!!! I don't post much but do check in almost daily to see what's happening...

Re: Back online now [Re: Kryssa] #109898
10/18/2016 11:57 AM
10/18/2016 11:57 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,855
Maine
Breeze Offline
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Breeze  Offline
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Posts: 1,855
Maine
I'm guessing banks and retailers had a rough weekend, too ???

Re: Back online now [Re: Breeze] #109899
10/18/2016 01:00 PM
10/18/2016 01:00 PM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,573
Eric_Hill Offline OP

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Eric_Hill  Offline OP

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Posts: 11,573
Think others did have an issue, it was an OC3 cable that was cut. In other words a whole lot of lines went down.


Eric Hill
TTOL Sponsors
Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109900
10/18/2016 01:42 PM
10/18/2016 01:42 PM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,150
JAX
jphart Offline
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jphart  Offline
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JAX
Eric: One word my friend: [color:"blue"]CLOUD[/color]
This ain't 1996 anymore. <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Yikes.gif" alt="" />

At least with an outage like this you discover how so many of us missed TTOL. Me included.

Last edited by jphart; 10/18/2016 01:43 PM.
Re: Back online now [Re: jphart] #109901
10/18/2016 01:50 PM
10/18/2016 01:50 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 364
Pacific NW
S
snmhanson Offline
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snmhanson  Offline
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S
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 364
Pacific NW
Thank god. I felt like a crack addict who had just entered rehab.

Well, maybe not quite that bad - but it did mess up my morning ritual (not to mention my afternoon, evening and "while I'm laying in bed trying to get to sleep" rituals).

Re: Back online now [Re: jphart] #109902
10/18/2016 01:51 PM
10/18/2016 01:51 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,067
South Jersey, USA
boatjunkie Offline
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boatjunkie  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,067
South Jersey, USA
Glad TTOL is back
Is it me or is the website much faster? Or is it because not everybody knows it's back up and are lots of band width



[Linked Image]
Re: Back online now [Re: jphart] #109903
10/18/2016 02:46 PM
10/18/2016 02:46 PM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,573
Eric_Hill Offline OP

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Eric_Hill  Offline OP

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Posts: 11,573
Nobody plans on a backhoe! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/duh.gif" alt="" /> No matter what is used anymore there are always problems, even with the cloud. Google, etc have all had problems at times with their cloud products, so there is no 100% solution.


Eric Hill
TTOL Sponsors
Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109904
10/18/2016 04:13 PM
10/18/2016 04:13 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
S
StormJib Offline
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StormJib  Offline
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Posts: 1,049
OC-3 just a short time ago was a very big pipe with 155.52 Mbit/s of throughput possible. Today many have that to their homes or at least half of the vintage OC-3 pipes performance numbers.

One option to limit the impact of any one backhoe is rented space even equipment in a harden data center with diverse service providers feeding the common "cloud" data center from opposite side. That way you have no single cable or service provider running in the same conduit that can fail you. The next step is to have the site hosted in a least two geographically dispersed data centers. That way a whole town can fall off the earth or be shut down with a disaster and the other site thousands of miles away can serve the customer. Amazon, Rackspace and many others sell those types of services in a very competitive market.

[Linked Image]

It takes two back hoes, two fires, or two floods to kills something that this. A good provider will offer services in three or more.

Re: Back online now [Re: StormJib] #109905
10/18/2016 05:00 PM
10/18/2016 05:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,891
NC
Fran Offline
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Fran  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,891
NC
Even though I don't post anymore, I still lurk, glad you're back online. I too was thinking maybe the problem was on my end.


[color:"red"]FRAN[/color] "Yes I am a pirate, 200 years too late"
[Linked Image]
Re: Back online now [Re: Fran] #109906
10/18/2016 05:40 PM
10/18/2016 05:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 926
Knoxville, Tennessee
Fred Offline
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Fred  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 926
Knoxville, Tennessee
Fran,

I've missed TTOL too, but it was worth it to see your post and hope you're doing well. Send me a PM and let me know.
Fred

Re: Back online now [Re: StormJib] #109907
10/18/2016 05:59 PM
10/18/2016 05:59 PM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,573
Eric_Hill Offline OP

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Eric_Hill  Offline OP

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Posts: 11,573
Ok, now let us think about this for a minute.

Cloud -- There is no magic cloud that has intel processors in it and invisible wire or hard drives or electric. If there is, could somebody tell me where that is?

The cloud is server farms in a building with electric, ac, etc and generally mulitiple internet (wired might I add -- as I have not seen this magical internet connection comming from any cloud around our house, just asking where this magical connection is?).

The cloud is in a building, maybe a block big. Yes redundant connections and maybe redundant servers, but generally in the same building even. So if the connections come in to the building at point A only, then there is a point of failure. If it is redundant to other servers over the "world" then maybe it will be fine..... ok, you are going to pay for this correct?? This is not free unlike you expensive membership to TTOL, right?

So you want redundant services all over the world, but you do not care what the cost is as long as you do not have to pay for it correct? Asking as, we have multiple servers to handle TTOL, each with multiple processors, each with multiple hard drives, etc. What we do not have is redundant bandwith. But based on the past performance, it has not been a problem, who plans on a backhoe. But YES, we could have multiple internet connections and even run the round robin, have done that a long time ago. That was before it was even common to think about and you where dealing with DSL for company websites, email, etc. That is not even a consideration now for a DSL type of setup.

So multiple dedicated yes, it can be done. Moving to the "cloud" is not the 100 per cent option and the cost is not something to laugh about. But I am open to your paying a annual fee for accesss! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/duh.gif" alt="" /> Ok, that is not going to happen I guess.

The hot topic is "cloud" and many do not even know what that actually is. It is still computers in a building that can catch fire, have a hurricane hit, etc. and it will go down whether you call it a cloud or not. Not magical, just hard computers/servers sitting on a rack, connected to you local electric company and connected to the local underground internet wires. That is you cloud. Just that it now runs apps instead of just plain storage. But still the same, just hard computers connected to wires.

And running it to mulitiple locations all over the world, having it sncy instantly, etc. No problem, just money. Unfortunately I am not google! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/jester.gif" alt="" />


Eric Hill
TTOL Sponsors
Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109908
10/18/2016 06:29 PM
10/18/2016 06:29 PM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 364
CA, USA
Pvgreg Offline
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Pvgreg  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 364
CA, USA
Using AWS is likely less costly than maintaining and regularly upgrading your own on premise hardware/software. When we considered upgrading our company SBS we found AWS to be a much more cost effective, better managed and secure option.

Re: Back online now [Re: StormJib] #109909
10/18/2016 06:42 PM
10/18/2016 06:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,344
Finger Lakes Region and Mexico
crmoores Offline
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crmoores  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,344
Finger Lakes Region and Mexico
Quote
StormJib said:
A good provider will offer services in three or more.


LOL! Let's pay for that provider! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/duh.gif" alt="" />


"Travel changes you. As you move through this life and this world you change things slightly, you leave marks behind, however small. And in return, life — and travel — leaves marks on you.”
-Anthony Bourdain
Re: Back online now [Re: crmoores] #109910
10/18/2016 07:09 PM
10/18/2016 07:09 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
S
StormJib Offline
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StormJib  Offline
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S
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
Quote
crmoores said:
Quote
StormJib said:
A good provider will offer services in three or more.


The outsource data center professionals can now deliver services for much less than the once did including geographically redundant locations that reduce risk and some of the costs for everyone involved. Upgrades and disaster recovery are just two reason two or more locations can reduce the total cost of ownership.


LOL! Let's pay for that provider! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/duh.gif" alt="" />

Re: Back online now [Re: Pvgreg] #109911
10/18/2016 07:21 PM
10/18/2016 07:21 PM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,573
Eric_Hill Offline OP

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Eric_Hill  Offline OP

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Posts: 11,573
That is nice that your company is doing it. Look quickly at the pricing. OK.

I am not amazon either.

Thanks for your support.


Eric Hill
TTOL Sponsors
Re: Back online now [Re: StormJib] #109912
10/18/2016 07:47 PM
10/18/2016 07:47 PM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,573
Eric_Hill Offline OP

Traveler
Eric_Hill  Offline OP

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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 11,573
Ok, so now I am suppose to provide redundant services. Just trying to get the facts straight. This was NOT a disaster recovery --- cut internet line, not any where near our servers even! The cut line was miles and miles away. But internet does not just go everywhere and have thousand of lines spread across farm fields, etc, that is just not the case anywhere.

Even if you have a building a block big. Multiple entry points -- if you are in a city, for example, generally ALL cables (electric and otherwise) run down the middle of the street. You did a hole in the middle of the street, even if ten cables, they all could be cut. Redundancy is only as good as the cables and location. Normally they are, in the same general location. So dig a big enough hole then you will take out everything, phone, internet, electric, etc. That is the way it is. This is not rocket science.

Yes, you can have multiple worldwide locations, sync, etc. That is not free.

So it boils down to cost and how is it going to be paid for. Right now it is the sponsors of TTOL. So do you support them and tell them that you appreciate their contribution to maintaining this simple community?


Eric Hill
TTOL Sponsors
Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109913
10/18/2016 07:58 PM
10/18/2016 07:58 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,855
Maine
Breeze Offline
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Breeze  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,855
Maine
Eric, there is and was no need for folks here to tell you what YOU should do.

It happens. A month ago my internet service provider had an outage that was caused by a construction screw-up.

Last summer, a construction incident took out the underwater cable that connects most of Maine and New Hampshire to the internet.

Full moon madness seems to have struck here and it is never a positive thing.

This one is over, we are all good, not a one of us has any injuries, physical or financial.

Re: Back online now [Re: Breeze] #109914
10/18/2016 08:06 PM
10/18/2016 08:06 PM
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 296
K
Kryssa Offline
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Kryssa  Offline
Traveler
K
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 296
If you have any interest in going cloud-based, I would be willing to contribute. Just putting it out there - the advice I've received on this board is priceless smile

Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109915
10/18/2016 08:08 PM
10/18/2016 08:08 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,375
New Jersey, USA
DanS Offline
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DanS  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,375
New Jersey, USA
Quote
Cloud -- There is no magic cloud that has intel processors in it and invisible wire or hard drives or electric. If there is, could somebody tell me where that is?


Eric, this explains it all:

xkcd: The Cloud <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Grin.gif" alt="" />

Glad to have you back.

Dan <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Cheers.gif" alt="" />

Re: Back online now [Re: Kryssa] #109916
10/18/2016 08:14 PM
10/18/2016 08:14 PM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 109
Bozeman / Minneapolis
snowdog Offline
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snowdog  Offline
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 109
Bozeman / Minneapolis
I agree about helping with the cost. There is another (non-sailing) board that I participate on and it takes donations. I don't think they bring in much $, but it helps to pay some of the bills. People contribute what they feel like and and it seems to work.


s/v Snow Dog - Leopard 46
Re: Back online now [Re: snowdog] #109917
10/18/2016 08:50 PM
10/18/2016 08:50 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,131
Ontario, Canada
warren460 Offline
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warren460  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,131
Ontario, Canada
Thank you Eric for all of your efforts keeping this site up an running for our collective benefit and for getting the site back up.

I hope that others feel the way I do.

Warren


Warren S/V Scuba Doo
Lagoon 50 (winner of best crewed yacht under 55 feet at the St. Thomas crewed yacht boat show).

https://www.cyabrochure.com/ebn/2307/pdyrX/6642/4///
Re: Back online now [Re: snowdog] #109918
10/18/2016 08:53 PM
10/18/2016 08:53 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,565
Woodstock, GA
RickinAtlanta Offline
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RickinAtlanta  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,565
Woodstock, GA
I can only speak with authority for GA Power. Our major customers, like Google, are served electrically by a concrete encased ductwork system that is virtually uninterruptable. Doesn't mean it can't happen but almost never. NOW that's power not internet.

Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109919
10/18/2016 09:40 PM
10/18/2016 09:40 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,974
Buffalo, NY
LauraTheTshirtGal Offline
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LauraTheTshirtGal  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,974
Buffalo, NY
Quote
Eric_Hill said:
There is a reward for the backhoe operator that dug up the major internet line.

In the last half hour the error and alarms lights finally cleared from the internet access card. Actually there is a truck roll that was on the way to possibly replace their access module because of all the errors.

Actually verizon is onsite right now, going to run a bunch of tests.


sounds like the Verizon overlords heard us!!! Kirk on Facebook thought the backhoe story wasn't dynamic enough so I told him that it was really Julian Assange, his final signal that he has been taken out is when TTOL goes down!! glad to have you guys back !!!! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Joy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Joy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Joy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Joy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Joy.gif" alt="" />

Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109920
10/18/2016 09:53 PM
10/18/2016 09:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 282
California
Sunnykm Offline
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Sunnykm  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 282
California
Eric, is it possible to put up an Amazon shopping portal? I would certainly use it for my Amazon purchases and you make a commission without any effort.

Karen <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Kiss.gif" alt="" />

Re: Back online now [Re: Sunnykm] #109921
10/19/2016 07:11 AM
10/19/2016 07:11 AM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,049
S
StormJib Offline
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StormJib  Offline
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Posts: 1,049
What many are finding is when the time comes to add the next server or upgrade a server they have. It can be less expensive and less disruptive to the business to simply use a data center service provider to fill the need. The business can focus on their core competency and pay a service to keep the power on, the connections to the internet up, the servers running in secure hardened environments purpose built to run 24/7. One key part of that is at least two sources of power and two paths to the global internet all backed up my matching networked centers in different geographies. That way no single disaster can take a service down. You bet that does cost more than a server(s) you may already own running in a closet somewhere. The question is what will the next server or upgrade costs and you can you do something better with that spend that just repeating what you did in the past. When you start paying your own people to watch those servers running the business case gets much easier.

Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109922
10/19/2016 07:28 AM
10/19/2016 07:28 AM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 76,709
Central Florida!
Carol_Hill Offline
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Carol_Hill  Offline
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Posts: 76,709
Central Florida!
So glad we are back online! You guys have no idea how frustrating this was!!! <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/cry.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, if anyone does want to contribute to our bandwidth fund, you can go here and scroll down to the bottom to make a contribution. For merchandise, we have some towel bags, a very limited amount of t-shirts still available, some coolies, and a few hats. Laura helps us out with the flags, so those are readily available. If someone is interested in any merchandise other than flags, please send Eric a PM first, DON'T just order in the shop, as we have only a very limited supply of most things. This might be a good opportunity for us to clear our all our merchandise.


Carol Hill
Re: Back online now [Re: Eric_Hill] #109923
10/19/2016 10:36 AM
10/19/2016 10:36 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 59
Los Gatos, CA
KevinM Offline
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KevinM  Offline
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Posts: 59
Los Gatos, CA
Eric, what you are getting at is summed up in a quote I've heard before: "There's no such thing as the 'cloud'. There's only other people's computers."

Glad to have the site back!

Kevin.


Leaopard 47 Cat - Magic Carpet
Got the sun on my shoulders, and my toes in the sand...
Re: Back online now [Re: KevinM] #109924
10/19/2016 11:14 AM
10/19/2016 11:14 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 36
W
wofat Offline
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Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 36
We're glad to have you back. I think folks are just trying to be helpful, not necessarily realizing that you live the reality on a daily basis.

I manage the infrastructure for my global organization and, trust me, I would LOVE to be able to use some of the cloud services for a lot of things, but cannot for various reasons. However, we do use AWS for some simple items and I have been amazed at how cheap it is. My bill from AWS (which is AMAZINGLY redundant and easy to use) is about $12/mo. You could POC it quite easily and get a sense for your potential costs. I only second this suggestion as you may be able to make life easier and perhaps make those small AD contributions go further.

Best of luck and glad you got back up and running. I was going through withdrawal!


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