CGB and WB become dangerous in certain swell conditions.

Cooper and some times marina cay become uncomfortable in certain swell Conditions. As these two have wide entrances to the anchorage and are deep, they are not dangerous. They boat may roll uncomfortably on its mooring.

Add the cut from Monkey Point to Marina Cay to the list of dangerous places in a north swell.

you can cab it from Great Harbor as well...thus avoiding all of the conversation regarding ground swells, crowded anchorages, dangerous dingy rides and drunken sailors...just sayin.

The link is a shot of Cane Garden Bay, I would not want to wake up to that starting up at 1:00AM. Like was said, understand the swell forecast. Also as noted above the deeper water you are in while anchored or moored the lesser effect of the swell.
http://www.wannasurf.com/spot/Central_Am...la-CIMG1029.jpg

This is all great (enlightening) information. We've overnighted at both White Bay and CGB on several occasions and never had an issue (in early December). Weren't even aware that they were fair-weather anchorages. Good to know.

It's interesting that the charter companies don't have a web site devoted to when to stay away from certain bays.

LOL. (Think you got a typo)!!

Thank you George!

Typo fixed. Apologies if anyone was offended.

I think many, if not most, repeat charterers to the BVI have experienced at least one night of rock-n-roll, if not worse ( as in drifting and colliding boats).

The question becomes, how does one inform the choices made when choosing an overnight location ?

I think the answer to that means being better informed, but getting better information also involves significant choices of HOW to get better information.

Luck only goes so far. The downside of a misinformed choice can be much worse than a sleepless night.

Some learning and reading here, accepting the experiences of others, is not a bad start to informing oneself.

Their lawyers will never want to take on that responsibility. At some point most of the places we enjoy with sand shores are unsafe. One of the laws of the sea is each captain is responsible for his own vessel and its safety. If a significant change is expected there is a good chance but no guarantee that someone local will knock on your hull with a heads up. If you are not at the dancing on the bar at the time? If you do not check your own weather and swell forecast late each day? You should be prepared to exit any of the open anchorages at a moments notice no matter what time the clock or contract say. If you can see open sea in any direction. One day wind, swell, and waves will come roaring in from that direction.

It seems to me that they have that responsibility anyway. The hull damage waiver paid by charterers is not really insurance. It self insurance. If there is a hurricane coming, they notify the charter boats. If their web site even had some links to swell and weather info, that could be helpful.

Well it's defined as an act of God.

Remember the idea or concept that you have internet coverage on a boat is very new and even with coverage many do not carry the devices. A prudent mariner and competent skipper is expected to be able to determine where and when to anchor on there own. I do not see any of the corporate operators getting into the business on what boats will be safe where on any given night. Keep in mind the location in the harbor can make a difference between OK and disaster. When storm warning are posted by the governing authorities the boats are hailed to return to port. Simply check your cruising guide each anchorage is noted when it is protected, unprotected, and those that are safe only in settled weather. If you are not positive the weather is "settled" do no try to stay there.

To expand on a question asked earlier, which number matters more, the 'Swell' or 'Swell period'? And how does the secondary swell play a part in it? I heard previously that a swell of more than 3 or 4ft was problematic in CGB and WB. It sounds like there may be more to it, though. Your expert opinions are appreciated.

Here's a Windguru reading as reference...

http://www.windguru.cz/int/index.php?sc=58

It really is more about direction. with height being a close second. remember some sites show in feet, others in meters. BIG difference.

CYOA redlined White Bay when we chartered with them.

Not a chance in hell I'd bring our boat in there- between the crowds during the day (we've seen MULTIPLE crashes) and the potential danger overnight it's totally not worth it.

We only dinghy from Great Harbour if conditions are VERY sunny & VERY flat seas. We've been caught on the way back from White Bay in a torrential rain, with a 9 hp dinghy motor & 6 of us frantically bailing water out with our painkiller cups. It was funny at the time because the sea was flat, but it could easily get ugly...just as simple to cab over from Great Harbour. Or a good way to walk off your Corsair's breakfast burrito by hiking over (and cabbing back!)

Here is a website that discusses swells.

http://magicseaweed.com/help/forecast/swell

You are correct, the hull damage waiver is not insurance. Ever charter boat either has an individual policy or is part of a fleet policy. The damage waiver basically covers the deductible of the yacht's insurance policy.

Each skipper is responsible for operating the boat safely and ensuring the crew and boat are not harmed. If you feel that you need a website to tell you when and where to anchor/moor safely, please consider hiring a professional captain. Or at least don't charter my boat... ;-)

This is silly. A website is just another source of information. If you need a chart to know where to anchor/moor safely I guess you don't qualify either?

No one is going to create a website declaring White Bay or Cane Garden Bay or any other place safe or unsafe by the day or hour. If you know the weather to be settled take your chances in there against a possible lee shore for a few hours. If there is any doubt on if the weather is stable or unstable. The boat and your guests will be better elsewhere. Stable means both the wind and the sea and the two may have nothing to do with one another. You can have absolutely no wind and experience the swell crashing in from a storm days ago thousands of miles away. Leave a boat anchored or on a mooring long enough in White Bay or Cane Garden Bay and you will experience god putting that boat on the beach, reef, or rocks. It is just a matter of time. In White Bay a drunk can crash into you at any time.

That's why our boat is not available for charter. Besides, what we are really talking about could come under the heading local knowledge. This is or should be part of the chart briefing. The briefing should also cover the local area tools to help the newbie stay safe.

Looks like somewhat of as N Swell headed to the VI this weekend

3 to 4 feet right now on the North Shore..

Swell right now then a short break and back for the weekend!

COASTAL WATERS FORECAST
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE SAN JUAN PR
1050 AM AST TUE OCT 27 2015

PUERTO RICO AND U.S. VIRGIN ISLANDS WATERS

SEAS ARE PROVIDED AS A RANGE OF THE AVERAGE HEIGHT OF THE HIGHEST 1/3
OF THE SEAS...ALONG WITH THE OCCASIONAL HEIGHT OF THE AVERAGE HIGHEST
10 PERCENT OF THE SEAS.

AMZ715-280330-
COASTAL WATERS OF NORTHERN USVI AND CULEBRA OUT 10 NM-
1050 AM AST TUE OCT 27 2015

REST OF TODAY
NORTHEAST WINDS 5 TO 10 KNOTS. SEAS 2 TO 4 FEET
WITH OCCASIONAL SEAS UP TO 5 FEET. DOMINANT PERIOD 10 SECONDS. NORTH SWELL UP
TO 4 FEET. NUMEROUS SHOWERS AND SCATTERED THUNDERSTORMS.

TONIGHT
EAST WINDS 10 TO 15 KNOTS. SEAS 3 TO 5 FEET WITH
OCCASIONAL SEAS UP TO 6 FEET. DOMINANT PERIOD 10 SECONDS. NORTH SWELL UP TO
4 FEET. NUMEROUS SHOWERS AND SCATTERED THUNDERSTORMS.

WEDNESDAY
EAST WINDS 5 TO 10 KNOTS. SEAS 3 TO 5 FEET WITH
OCCASIONAL SEAS UP TO 6 FEET. DOMINANT PERIOD 10 SECONDS. NUMEROUS SHOWERS
AND SCATTERED THUNDERSTORMS.

WEDNESDAY NIGHT
EAST WINDS 5 TO 10 KNOTS. SEAS 3 TO 5 FEET WITH
OCCASIONAL SEAS UP TO 6 FEET. DOMINANT PERIOD 10 SECONDS. ISOLATED
THUNDERSTORMS IN THE EVENING. SCATTERED SHOWERS THROUGH THE NIGHT.

THURSDAY
EAST WINDS 5 TO 10 KNOTS. SEAS 3 TO 5 FEET WITH
OCCASIONAL SEAS UP TO 6 FEET. DOMINANT PERIOD 13 SECONDS. SCATTERED SHOWERS
AND ISOLATED THUNDERSTORMS.

FRIDAY
EAST WINDS AROUND 10 KNOTS. SEAS 2 TO 4 FEET WITH
OCCASIONAL SEAS UP TO 5 FEET. DOMINANT PERIOD 11 SECONDS. NORTH SWELL UP TO
4 FEET. SCATTERED SHOWERS. ISOLATED THUNDERSTORMS.

SATURDAY
EAST WINDS 10 TO 15 KNOTS. SEAS 2 TO 4 FEET WITH

Does that match up to this WindGuru report? I'm still trying to interpret the importance of Height, Period, Direction, and Primary/Secondary.

http://www.surf-forecast.com/weather_maps/British-Virgin-Islands

I would take these combined sources to say.

Bubbly pool will be good, not dangerous

CGB will see some wave breaks on the reef that might make it a bit rolly

I'd stay away from WB

Stay out of the outer moorings at Cooper towards point a quart


but, thats just my judgement.

On a much more general and broader perspective. The forecast is not "settled" the wind direction with shift, the swell direction will change. You could anchor in one condition and find another condition in just a few hours.

This has been a very useful thread. I have picked up 2 new web sites to cionsider

You're right at this time of the year the seasons are changing and North swells will become more common and enter the area with little or no warning.

Can someone provide a link to an image of a sailboat on shore in white Bay? Thanks in advance.

Perhaps someone will have better luck searching than I, and can refresh our memories of the Mr Bill wreck last year .

It's amazing how these ship designers think of every type of situation.
<img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Clapping.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif" alt="" />

I think this is the thread you're looking for:

http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/s...part=5&vc=1

Thanks Collen, that is exactly what I am looking for.

Thank you Colleen, that is exactly the thread.

We picked up the farthest west mooring in White Bay about 10 years ago on a late February night. Calm when we tied up. Ended up the worst night ever on a mooring in the BVI in 35 trips. Believe it or not the dinghy filled and sank to 3 inches above water. Engine submerged. OMG what an adventure.

I had a night caused by a Thunderstorm in WB I will not forget. Had a boat drag down on us at 3 AM and snag our anchor chain. A mess to sort out with waves breaking over the reef. The mono that snagged us was being slammed down on its keel in the troughs of each wave.
I also watched a Moorings 4300 drag onto the reef after a 90 degree wind shift while crew was ashore.
G